Which source did you use once you got into 3GSource.com?

Great information Cindy, I know you said you paid a monthly fee, are your minutes limited? How many do you get?......... Doncat

Norm Payne is always a good source of information and quite likable in person. I still want to see how his cellular internet does in the West, that is the area where cell phone service has the most holes. I do know he won't get online in Big Bend National Park or Death Valley National Park since I didn't encounter a single person who was able to use a cell phone in those places with external antennas and amplifiers. For many this will not matter, since they will live with not being online here and there just like us satellite internet folks who sometimes cannot get online due to trees and mountains.
Right now we just upgraded our Hughes.net service from a DW6000 Home Plan to a HN7000s Pro Plan, costing us $10/month more and committing us to 15 more months of service. We will be watching how everyone does with cell phone internet, it is obviously getting better. We will also be paying close attention to those who travel to the same places we do. The smaller size and much easier setup of cellular internet compared to our manually pointed satellite dish is very tempting. We have been in places where cellular would work and satellite is hard due to trees and mountains (though mountains can block cellular if the mountain blocks the tower).
We have travelled in Canada and expect to do so again. We also expect to do some travelling into Mexico. Cell phone internet is not a good choice for Canadian or Mexican travel, but satellite internet does work. We might still change to cellular in a couple years even if it means using Wi-Fi or internet cafes in Canada and/or Mexico.

Greetings to all on this thread!

We travel extensively in our MH.  I, too, use the Internet for business, thus this subject hits close to home.  I am not pushing or knocking brands.  These are just the facts I have found to be true in the areas we have traveled.

We had a T-Mobile air card with unlimited hours.  This worked quite satisfactorily in most areas, but not all.  The farther we strayed from the Interstate System, the more spotty the coverage became.  The other factor was it was rather slow.  Granted they have a new card that is somewhat faster, but the coverage has not changed significantly.

The first of the year, we switched service to Verizon for two phones and their best air card with unlimited hours of use.  The difference has proved almost unbelievable.  We have only been in three places that we got no telephone service.  In most areas, we are receiving Broadband Internet connection.

I am typing this from the back, back woods of Maine.  Last year we received no cell service at all in the entire state of Maine.  On this trip we have spent time in the boonies of TN, KY and near Northport, MI.  My cousin who lives in MI does not get cell service when they are at their cabin in Northport.  We did.  They were astounded.  We also used the Internet constantly.

What amazes us is at times our phones indicate no bars for service, yet we get good reception.

Bottom line is that for us Verizon has better coverage nationwide than other providers. (Our experience.)  We are not using an external antenna or booster.  I am quite confident that would be necessary in some western states. 

I agree with others above that the air card situation is rapidly improving and should continue to do so with more entries into offering routers that will accept air cards.  Once such a router is added to the system with an external antenna the reception area will no doubt expand.  A booster will surely improve that.  To date, we have not needed to add this.

The best advantages are Internet reception is available in motion and does not require a treeless site when stationary.  Is it equal to a motosat?  No.  However, at the present time, it is a close second in the areas we are traveling, even away from major corridors and cities.  For us, it is move than sufficient.  I anticipate adding an external antenna, a booster and a router as more routers are availale with air card slots.

Please, everyone, keep us up to date on routers that work well.  This forum is always filled with good information.  Thanks to all who jump in!

Charles

I must say that I have been amazed with the wireless broadband coverage improvements recently.  And I never expected people to be able to get broadband coverage in areas where they can't get voice coverage.  Strange. 

My reply here would pretty much have echoed bjoyce's comments as a satellite internet user (other than we have an automatic dish and he has a tripod). 

I'm still a little skeptical of coverage in remote areas.  But as more information becomes available, it will be interesting to see the coverage comparisons.

Currently, I still prefer the satellite internet if we are comparing only monthly costs.  However, if cellular broadband had been as reliable in as many places as I am hearing it is now, we might have opted for the cheaper up front investment.

Since we already have a cellular amplifier and booster antenna, I am considering the cellular air card option as a back-up.  It would be nice, on occasion, to have access on the fly and to park in a completely shaded site once in awhile.  However, it would be tough to have a $60 a month "back-up" though.  :)

With that said, you can bet us satellite internet users will be keeping a close eye on new developments and verified remote coverage areas. 

P.S.
Another good source for cellular amplifiers, etc. is PrimeCellular.com   

I was chatting with several members of the RV-Dreams family in the chat room the other day.  Eventually, the topic of Internet connections and cellular cards came up.  After a few moments, it became clear to me that I had taken a technology journey that others might be interested in.

We are weekend warriors that plan to become full-timers when we reach a point where we can quit working.  Our current goal is 5 years.  I mention this because we can’t justify the cost of a dedicated Internet dish.  Plus, there is a real chance that when we finally reach our goal, we will purchase a new coach.  We’ve been at this for three years.  And the technological advancements as well as creative design advancements in the living quarters have been incredible.  I can only imagine what the next 5 years will bring.


Our Internet connectivity solution has come via cellular service and the use of a cellular air card.  The comp any I work for introduced the Sprint mobile service about 6 years ago.  I used that service then.  And, from shear habit have continued.

About a year ago, I read about a cellular signal booster called Smooth Talker in another RV forum.  So, I looked into it.  I had just got my Sprint card and was obligated to a 2-year contract.  So, after talking with the Smooth Talker engineers, I found out several drawbacks to the Sprint card.  First of all, sprint uses a proprietary network.  So, I needed a booster that worked only on the Sprint network.  Then, I found out that while most boosters are 3 watt, the Sprint booster was only 2 watts due to the way the sprint network was configured.  Then, I found out that the Sprint booster only worked in Sprint digital network range.  When we were in analog areas or analog roaming areas, I needed an analog signal booster.  While Sprint advertises their vast coverage, the truth is that I experience signal loss, even in my own home, which is a strong signal area, according to Sprint.  So, I bought both boosters and all the cables to interconnect them to keep me from having to go through the hassle of trying to figure out which booster I needed and keep changing between the two.  Well, the result was disappointing.  While there was a signal boost, it was not reliable enough for me.  So, I contacted the Smooth Talker engineers again.  They have been great.  They explained to me the pros and cons of each of the cellular cards.

Next, I became interested in developing a LAN on the RV.  After finding some helpful folks on RVForum.com, I found a router made by Kyocera that utilized my cellular card as a router connection.  The router provides hard-wired connections and wifi connections.  The makers of the router suggested the cellular card and service by Verizon.  Then, came an article in Motorhome Magazine that addressed the exactly subject of RV networks.  They suggested the Kyocera KR-1 router and the Verizon card also.  My brother, who is also a weekend warrior, purchased that combination and had far better connectivity in far more places than I have.

So, I went back to the engineers at Smooth Talker.  I think I understood them to tell me that when I went into digital roaming mode on my Sprint card, I was actually roaming on the Verizon network.  I’m not 100% sure about that.  I’d hate to mislead anyone or get the Smooth Talker folks in any hot water.  So, I can only say that is what I thought I heard.  I was sitting around watching TV one night and saw a Verizon commercial that offered a 30-day free trial on their network.  My contract with Sprint is up in two months.  So, I decided to do a little test.  It turns out that the booster I got from Smooth Talker is the one I needed for the Verizon card recommended.  All I needed was a connection cable for the Verizon card.  I signed up for the 30-day trial.  It turns out that I get adequate service in areas where I couldn’t get any sprint signal.  

I live in Jacksonville, Florida.  So, my travel is limited to Georgia and Florida.  I started thinking that Cingular is the old BellSouth.  That is the telephone company that is based in the Southeast US.  So, it made sense to me that their service should be very strong here.  So, it was back to the Smoother Talker engineers.  It turns out that they don’t have a connection cable capable of connecting to the new sierra card offered by Cingular.  I contacted Cingular and they offered a 30-day trial also.  So, I tried that card without the booster.  The success was marginal at best.

With all this said, my final choice was the Verizon / Kyocera / Smooth Talker combination.  It provides service that rivals my DSL at home in areas that offer G3 service.  And with the booster, I get acceptable speed in areas such as state parks that generally are a long way from a cell tower.  I sent back the Cingular card and ended up not having to pay anything for the trial.  I’m biting the bullet with Sprint and when the contract is ended, I’ll be gone from there.

As far as costs go, the Verizon service is about $ 70 per month.  It will drop when I move my entire cellular account to Verizon.  The card cost me $50.  The router was around $ 250.  But, I think demand and availability has caused that to drop.  Plus, Linksys offers a similar product.  The Smooth Talker booster was around $ 250.  I’m not sure about that part.  Since I bought two of the boosters and cables, I spent around $850 with them.

It’s a bit pricy, but less than the dish.  Plus, I don’t have to look for a clear view of the sky for the Internet, just the TV satellite dish.  I am able to connect to my work networks, so I can work from any place I can get a signal.  Also, I’m pursuing an MBA with University of Phoenix, so I need connectivity for schoolwork.  So, I have a couple of justifications.  And, when folks near me in RV parks discover they can ride on my network for connectivity, my popularity really soars.  It’s nice to be loved.

 

Kevin,

Thanks for sharing your experience.  In September we have to do something different for internet connection and have been looking at Air Cards.  Currently we are with Cingular (now AT&T) but can testify to the marginal performance of their Air Card.  Sprint has been advertising heavily and sounds good but Verizon sounds like the best from what I have been reading.  Your entry is very helpful in determining what other products match well with the verizon Air Card.  The sad thing is that all of these companies want a two year commitment when techonolgy changes, at the very least, every six months.  Right now we have Road Runner service by Time Warner for $30 a month but once we leave this campground we'll need something else - depending on WIFI hot spots is a pain in the neck (as well as lower parts). 

Verizon people are happy unless they really use it heavily and hit the 5GB per month data transfer limit and then they are spitting mad. 5GB a month is not that hard to hit for some of people, especiallly if they like to download movies or Linux CD images, but many do not come near. Multiple people using one air card through a router can also increase your chances of hitting the limit.
Sprint does not have that limit. I don't know if Cingular or T-Mobile have limits but their speeds are not up to what Sprint or Verizon can give you.
Most people have not hit the 5GB monthly limit on Verizon but they just upgraded to Rev A on their entire network so the added speed might catch a few more.
My view is do your large downloads on free Wi-Fi systems and use your Verizon aircard for the normal email, web surfing, chat rooms, etc.
I still think either satellite or cell phone internet is a large cost for non-full timers to use unless they also use it as their internet at home. $50 to $70 month for something you only use part time seems out of line. These are changing technologies, if you are not going full time in the next six months to a year it is probably best to wait and see what is available closer to your full time graduation date.

I use Cingular 3g, and so far it has been a great experience. My card is an Express Card made by Novatel, its not offered from (AT&T) Cingular but you can get one from Dell , I have it on my HP laptop running Vista premium.

The RV park we are currently staying in has free WiFi but , it drops connection to often, so we use the card. Speed is an average of 800 down and 240 up. Plenty fast, there is no written limit on the service but the contract does state in their FAP (fair access policy) that the card is not to be used for downloading videos or music or P2P (peer to peer) connections,RSS feeds etc. Right now they have not been enforcing the letter of the contract, that may change eventually, but even HughsNet has a FAP policy that will zap you if you get too crazy with the downloads and or uploads.

Ken

My wife (cksck ) and I live in a rural area and have been using Hughes (perviously DirecWay) satellite internet for about three years. We recently switched to Verizion wireless broadband. We've had our eye on the coverage map for a year or so but it always seemed our area was not covered. A neighbor took the plunge recently and got good service. So, we followed suit. It seemed the satellite service was getting even flakier than normal over the last couple of months, so we were very much open to an alternative.

I am a contract software developer, and good internet access is required for my job as well as for entertainment. :) Cable and DSL are still not available out here, and it was dial up or satellite. We did a stint with ISDN for a while, and that was pretty good, but then it seems both the phone company and the ISP (Earthlink) we're dropping support of ISDN, then DirectWay became the only choice.

Having been Verizon voice customers for years, we went with the Verizon broadband plan ($60/mo). I did some research on evdoforums and talked with a few other people, and it appears that Verizon has the best coverage around the country, especially with regards to the newer, faster Rev-A network. Having immediate relief from the satellite at home was a big improvement, but being able to take the equipment with us in the RV is certainly a big plus. When we make that final step to full-timing (hopefully in about one year), then that national coverage becomes even more important.

The 5G/month limit does not thrill me, though I think Bill's suggestion of using hotspots and whatnot to download larger items. is a good one We don't download much video, but I do listen to a number of podcasts, and they do add up in size. OS and other software updates do as well. I think for normal web surfing, email etc, 5GB should be okay.  We don't watch a lot of TV, but one day it would be nice to make use of Apple TV or TiVo/Unbox or whatever to download some shows over night, perhaps catch others over the air, and avoid satellite service altogether. That won't be possible with Verizon for the foreseeable future, and it sounds like at least Cingular has a policy against using their network for this kind of thing. I'm not sure if Sprint does or not. Hopefully, as more capacity is put into place, WiMax (4G?) arrives, etc., such restrictions will be relaxed.

I too bought equipment from 3gstore.com. They were most helpful in selection and everything went together so well I did not need to call for any tech support etc.  I had read numerous forum posts regarding complaints about the slow pace of the Kyocera KR1 firmware updates. There were also VPN issues with that router, and the D-Link. I did not want to face those issues, as VPN access is very important for my work. The Hughes satellite often made that a challenge as well. The Linksys EVDO router sounds nice, but it's for Sprint only (at least official support is). I really liked the Linksys WRT54G router we've been using with the satellite service all these years, and recommended it to several other people.

So, being a Verizon customer, I opted for the Top Global MB6000 EVDO router. It takes a standard PC card EVDO aircard, and provides WiFi and one wired ethernet port. It has all the good WiFi security features, including WPA.  I did not find any consistent complaints about this router except for its shape (Pyramid) and the fact that the WiFi (g and b) is somewhat lacking in range and speed. I got the Verizon V740 aircard, which is an ExpressCard/34 size card. This is the card slot size for newer laptops, such as my Macbook Pro. I got an adaptor that allows this card to be used in both the router as well as my wife's older Powerbook. Normally, operation will be via the router and Wifi, but I can see it being handy to take along one of the laptops in the car with just the aircard.

I also got a booster antenna. This is simply an indoor quality antenna that hooks up to the antenna input on the aircard. Given our fringe coverage area, and the fact the antenna costs only about $50, I decided to get it. Here at home, it does bump the signal strength one bar, which does result in faster rates (according to speedtests I've run from broadbandreports.com).  3gstore also sells an amplifier which I've not yet purchased. We don't need it here at home, but it may prove useful in the RV. Speed test results are typically around 1.8Mb/s download and 300 Kb/s upload. The latency is pretty small as well, a big improvement over the satellite! :)  This would be so perfect if that 5GB/mo limit was not staring us in the face.

So far we are very happy with the setup, but we've not yet taken it anywhere. :)  I'm glad to hear of such positive results others are getting using Verizon.

Take care,

Jeff

Hi,
Jeff wrote about our history and current set up for Verizon wireless broadband above. I wanted to add a couple comments from our experience here in a "rural" area of California.  Believe it or not, we work in Silicon Valley, but have not had high bandwidth internet access in the mountains we live in around SV.  :)

Anyway, as a user, I will say that our change to Verizon broadband is fantastic compared to our Hughes/Direcway satellite.  The Hughes was constantly having access problems, performance problems -- and if you do any reasonable downloads you get FAP'd  and that really, really stinks.  We are not gamers, we do not download video, or other large entertainment media, etc.  Unfortunately, just downloading an OS or SW update for your computer is so large that it would get us FAP'd on Hughes.  :(

Cost-wise, there isn't a difference for us.  Our Hughes satellite service cost $60/month.  Our new Verizon wireless broadband costs $61/month. Yes, Verizon required a 2 year contract. However, Hughes also required a contract (I think it was 18 months) when we first signed up with them.  From our budget point of view, it's a wash.   There is not really any additional expensive equipment to buy to make the wireless work, either.

With the antenna booster Jeff got, our access speeds are MUCH better with Verizon than they ever were with our satellite. And, reliability has been 100% great for the 2 months we've had it.  We are definitely in a fringe access area and are so happy it now works at our house. Just as an example about our location  -- up until very recently we had to have analog/digital cell phones because we needed analog to get service at our house. :)


I think the biggest problem with Verizon is the 5GB/month limit.  Our first month, we used 4.8Gb -- and that was just doing normal stuff. :(  Again, no crazy downloads or anything. So, we'll have to see how that works. I think the broadband wireless companies intend to sell their services to business folks, not typical home users. It will be interesting to see if they offer bands of data access in the future for different fees.   Who knows, this is all a new area they are figuring out.

For our previous RV trips we used a cell phone modem -- ugh, so slow.   We are going to love having this new wireless broadband when we leave for our fall trip. :)  

Don't know if my comments are helpful. I guess I'm a satisfied "customer" of "Jeff the IT guy" are our home. :) :)
c-

I don't know how to find the Cingular coverage map, but I can point you to the Verizon broadband national coverage map. It is here:
Verizon national coverage map.

Of course, you can go to their site and get specific info per city or zip code, if that's more helpful for you:
Verizon address or ZIP specific coverage map

Note that Broadband Access is the highest speed access (600-1.4Mbps download, 500-800Kbps upload), while the "National Access" is at a much lower bandwidth (From Verizon site: "Connect at speeds bursting up to 144 Kbps, with typical speeds of 60 to 80 Kbps. "). Most of the country is at the lower National Access bandwidth right now. Until the wireless carriers can build more infrastructure out, that will be a bummer. :(

Huh, looking at the coverage map, clearly a satellite will get you better download bandwidth regardless of your location compared to the wireless broadband solutions. Another plus for satellite vs wireless broadband. Upload is of course still an issue with satellite. :)

We found that the local address coverage map was not entirely accurate. We live in a rural, hilly/mountain area and according to their coverage map we wouldn't have broadband access. But, we do with no issues. I think it's harder to predict accurately when you are near valleys and mountains that can help or hinder the access. :)

Good luck,
c-



-- Edited by cksck at 14:54, 2007-07-07

-- Edited by cksck at 14:56, 2007-07-07

-- Edited by cksck at 15:00, 2007-07-07

-- Edited by cksck at 15:06, 2007-07-07

This is a huge issue for a lot of folks.  As you know, those of us with satellite internet are wondering how the cellular broadband coverage compares.

So I am trying to get one of the cellular companies to provide us free broadband service so we can do a side-by-side comparison of coverages.  I think that would help provide a great deal of information for everyone, and I'm sure they would more than make up for the service provided to us if the results are good.  I'll keep you posted if I can pull that off. 

P.S.  I have heard from several people in stick houses that have been unhappy with their Hughes.net satellite internet.  I don't know why, but it seems there are more complaints from stationary users of satellite internet than there are from mobile users.  Interesting.   

For the wireless broadband access, I think it really depends where you spend most of your time when RVing. As you can see from the Verizon coverage map I posted above, the access bandwidth varies significantly if you are in the broadband areas vs in the "National Access" areas. And, of course, there are parts of the country where there is no wireless access at any speed. :( Each company will have it's own coverage maps. Perhaps those of you who have Sprint or Cingular could post pointers to their country-wide coverage maps for comparison?

This is one thing where satellite has a huge advantage. Of course, that assumes that you like to camp in areas where you can manage to line your satellite up without trees, etc, in the way. :) :) We tend to camp in national forests and would have a lot of trouble with the trees. We usually can't keep our GPS working in areas we camp and hike...so...

Anyway, Howard, it would be interesting to find if any of the companies will give you a test trial. I'd think you'd need it for quite a while to be in enough areas with varying coverage to get a real "feel" for it. Good luck!

PS - Howard, we are one of those houses that have had rotten experience with our Direcway/Hughes satellite over the years. I wonder why you have such a great experience? I don't know if we are routed through different NOC locations. That could make a difference, since most of the issues we have are definitely on the Hughes service side (ie: not weather or anything local to us). Huh. Interesting.
c-

-- Edited by cksck at 23:46, 2007-07-10