Since there are a few Ram 5500 owners regularly on this forum I thought I would see if I could get a little feedback on insuring a Ram 5500 Hauler Truck. New Horizon Majestic is now complete and we have plans to head to Classy Chassis in approx three weeks to pick up our new Ram 5500 Hauler Truck and then over to New Horizon to pick up the new 5th wheel that is waiting. I am getting some push back from my insurance agent trying to obtain quotes for coverage on the truck. Safeco, my carrier for most of my insurance will not cover a truck such as this. There reason was size and cost, $100k. Would love to hear who some of you have your coverage through and what the annual cost is. My agent is reaching out to other carriers now. Trying to brace myself for the cost shock.
Thanks in advance for any feed back.
Bill and Linda said
07:50 AM Dec 9, 2017
Depending on your state of residence this is either "oh my!" or no big deal. Contact Miller Insurance, Marlene J. Bounds, (503) 636-6347. They do this. Most local agents don't have the expertise or availability of insurance products to deal with commercial trucks in private use. Miller does. Not all agents have access to all products from underwriters - don't care what the agent says, they don't. ("Ask me how I know this.")
I know this sounds weird, but what you probably need is a "Motor Home" policy. That's what it is called and yes I know you're not purchasing a Motor Home. But Progressive, and others, have a policy that covers your trailer and truck independently, but if you do both with the same company the commercial truck rate is way less - depending on your home state - that's the sticky deal - your state. Our costs were actually far less on the Ram 5500HD then on the Chevy 3500HD - both trucks were built by Classy. Don't forget to insure for the full value with the up-fit, NOT just based on VIN number. Big difference.
PM me if you care to. As you can see by the sig we have a NH, Ram 5500HD and have tread this road before.
Gregk said
08:23 AM Dec 9, 2017
Bill,
Thanks for your reply. Been following a few of you guys on here with same truck and trailers now for some time and felt sure i could get a little guidance from you guys. Initial quote from my agent was for truck coverage of $950/yr. After providing Vin# they came back with a refusal to insure due to truck type and size and cost. I felt sure that the initial quote was too low at $950 and am expecting much higher cost ultimately. I will reach out to the agent you noted and continue weeding through everything.
We are excited to get moving on picking up both the truck and 5th wheel next month. Kind of hate that the guys at NH finished the trailer ahead of schedule as it is now sitting in their parking lot (winterize of course) waiting to be picked up. Tom at CC says truck should be ready second week of Jan. Hopefully we will be lucky with the weather in Jan when we head up from Texas to pick everything up.
Thanks again,
Greg
Bill and Linda said
12:29 PM Dec 9, 2017
Gregk wrote:
Bill, {Edit}
We are excited to get moving on picking up both the truck and 5th wheel next month. Kind of hate that the guys at NH finished the trailer ahead of schedule as it is now sitting in their parking lot (winterize of course) waiting to be picked up. Tom at CC says truck should be ready second week of Jan. Hopefully we will be lucky with the weather in Jan when we head up from Texas to pick everything up.
Thanks again, Greg
Greg, have to chuckle a bit. We've picked up both our trucks from Tom in the snow. Actually needed the 4-WD coming home with the 5500HD.
If Tom says second week of Jan. bet it will be ready. One thing he does is not over promise and under deliver.
Suggest you plan on plenty of time at pickup of the NH. Don't leave till it is to your satisfaction. Much easier to get any new rig checked out at delivery rather than going back. It takes time to do a full checkout and the only way is to actually live it in a few days and try everything. A walk through just does't cut it with any new rig, NH included.
Let us know if we can help.
Bill
Glenn West said
02:47 PM Dec 9, 2017
Miller is who you need to call. Gentleman that started this company is a RVer himself and realizes our needs. Policies are wrote around rvers. We have them and they insure our HDT. Your 5500 should be no problem.
Gregk said
06:53 AM Dec 12, 2017
Bill,
Big thanks to you for the heads up on Marlene at Miller Ins. Save me a substantial amount of money and hassle.
Happy Hilidays
Bill and Linda said
08:51 AM Dec 12, 2017
Gregk wrote:
Bill,
Big thanks to you for the heads up on Marlene at Miller Ins. Save me a substantial amount of money and hassle.
Happy Hilidays
Your most welcome - that was the goal. Marlene knows her stuff and they do know the RV / Truck / Motor Home business.
BTW, you need to catch up with the New Horizons Owners Group - NHOG for short. While we may be fewer in number we try to share info on the NH rigs. Search around for the names by sig. We also do a rally every 18 months. The last in Spearfish, SD was great. We all share info and fiddle with the trailers. Lots of little - sometimes big - things get fixed. Just get out your tool box and 6 people will show up ready to work. LOL
The next rally will be in the Spring of 2019 - no official date yet but before the heart of "official travel season" as Neil of "Neil and Connie" likes to say. "Lynn and Ed" who are on this forum are co-Rally masters with another couple whom I don't believe frequent here. All great people to be around.
Welcome to the group and the forum.
Bill
Glenn West said
09:59 PM Dec 12, 2017
Just curious, why a 5500 at 100k when you could have got a practically new HDT for that price, with full warranty? Know they are not for everyone but we love ours. Mine seats 5 also. Added couch to sleeper. Knocks out 7 mpg towing 21k. Newer ones are getting as high as 10 mpg. Don't get my post wrong. Not criticizing your choice.
Gregk said
07:45 AM Dec 13, 2017
Glenn,
I guess I fall into that category of many RVer's that look at the HDT as a truck as one that will be a little more difficult to deal with when not towing. We live in Texas and spend two months a year in Colorado along with a few more outings per year but do not full time. Obviously my goal was to be able to pull the set up with plenty of safe capacity and both set ups would do that. Don't get me wrong, I think the HDT is an awesome set up but I just wanted a truck that would be a little more user friendly when not towing.
I do appreciate your point though.
Thanks
Glenn West said
11:50 AM Dec 13, 2017
If we were all the same be a very boring world. We live in Texas most of the time also. I travel and work full time but rv full time. I use the HDT as a truck when I need to. Not a problem. I also carry a SmartCar for my daily commute. I did tow with a dually, 3500. It was a pain as a daily commute. Seems we do agree on 3500 just not enough truck for these heavy 5thers.
Bill and Linda said
12:06 PM Dec 13, 2017
Glenn West wrote:
Just curious, why a 5500 at 100k when you could have got a practically new HDT for that price, with full warranty? Know they are not for everyone but we love ours. Mine seats 5 also. Added couch to sleeper. Knocks out 7 mpg towing 21k. Newer ones are getting as high as 10 mpg. Don't get my post wrong. Not criticizing your choice.
Glenn, this is a very good conversation to have and in some cases this is the old Ford/Chevy discussion on steroids.As I have discussed with Jack many times – in our case – it’s because we don’t want an HDT.
Here’s our reasons: Saying first off, I am licensed to drive an HDT, have a Class A, and drove them for business with 18 speed Fuller transmissions. So I know what I am talking about as pertains to the decision for us. It’s different for others. This is not an absolute.
1 – An HDT is not required for us. – My true Class V MDT – which most mistake for a luxury pickup till they see the insignia on the side – even with the 24,250 GVWR trailer, still has lots of capacity left. Beyond about 26,500 trailer GVW I would have an HDT – no question.
2 – The Ram fits in a garage. Yes, that matters to us. Not too many, but to us it does.
3 – There is most always a Ram (or Ford / Chevy) dealer around should service be required – especially true in Alaska and Canada. HDT parts and service are not as plentiful in an emergency for HDT’s. (“Ask me how I know this.”) And if necessary a “standard” wrecker can tow the 5500HD. Not so with an HDT.
4 – Even with air-ride seats and all in the HDT the Ram is simply more comfortable to ride in – especially solo. One can say this is opinion – agreed. But for us with full air-ride on the rear axle the Ram rides wonderfully solo and we don’t “bounce” as is the case with some air-ride seats.
5 – Parts and repairs, in many cases, are less money. (I acknowledge – “It depends.”)
6 – The Ram is a lot lower physically off the ground to get in. Today, this doesn’t matter as much; tomorrow it might. But for us it is much easier as a “grocery getter” and a touring vehicle.
7 – I can use the hauler bed as a pickup when desired and do so on a lot of occasions.
8 – We have no need / desire for a Smart Car hauler so the HDT isn’t necessary for that purpose.
9 – The true purchase costs for an HDT will be the same or more than the “$100K” Hauler Bed converted Class V, IMO. Not saying one can’t find a good used HDT for less. But when I have investigated, and I have, the cost difference just isn’t there for what we would purchase. Naturally YMMV depending on truck criteria.
10 – I can work on the Ram (or Ford or Chevy) with most basic tools and have some spares. I can change a tire in a pinch. Just can’t do that with an HDT. (Recall, I had HDT’s in a business environment.)
11 – I can enter any campground without concern because the MDT “looks” like a pickup. Some, not a lot, but some CG’s are not HDT friendly. I know there is an HDT friendly directory. Naturally YMMV.
12 – The new MDT Ram will last as long as we need. True, a relatively low mileage HDT can out last the Ram. But I don’t plan to drive the “million miles.” 300,000 should do us pretty well.
You said, don’t take the question to Glenn as criticism. I certainly didn’t. I consider this an important conversation to have for those reading along. I think for some HDT’s are without a doubt the best choice – many times the only choice. But there are good reasons some of us chose the MDT route. They just fit our needs much better and the cost difference between the used HDT and the new MDT simply wasn’t there for us. Again, a choice.
Bill
Terry and Jo said
09:07 AM Dec 14, 2017
Just to add to Bill's comment, I also drove 18-wheelers in my past. For me, I would not want an HDT because of the visibility issues. With most HDT's, one has to rely on mirrors, and I really like being able to turn my head and look out windows to see, especially with regards to backing into an RV site at an angle.
Granted, our Mobile Suites is only 18,500 lbs when loaded, so our Ford F450 is plenty big enough for that.
Terry
Glenn West said
10:24 AM Dec 14, 2017
I use mirrors and cameras. Actually see better with truck. Can't carry but so many vehicles and I really hate a dually as a daily commute. With my work, I have to park in very congested parking lots. Last one had thousands of vehicles. I had to get to job hours early to get a decent parking place. With the Smartcar I wait to near start time and get a spot everyone else past by for being too tight. Just right for Smart. I take small jobs sometimes, between large jobs. they are short shutdowns, days. I just stay in truck. Also we have 34kish in truck. That includes all mods I have done. I do get better mpg, not a lot, but is better. If I had gotten a 5500, it would have to be my daily commute. Did not want that. It would have to have air suspension. This would be a custom truck such as you have. 100k. We just didn't want to spend that kind of money. I have had to do some work on the HDT. I find it easy to work on. I can get to stuff. New trucks are a bear to work on. I also was able to convert to air over hydraulic disc brakes on Teton. Sweet setup. No wires going to them, just air. I have towed my Teton with a 3500. That was tense. Also I had an issues with my brakes a while back. One reason for brake upgrade. I disconnected and carried on with trip. I had ample brakes. Will the 5500 stop your weights with its brakes only? My 3500 would not.
Bill and Linda said
11:20 AM Dec 14, 2017
Glenn West wrote:
I use mirrors and cameras. Actually see better with truck. Can't carry but so many vehicles and I really hate a dually as a daily commute. With my work, I have to park in very congested parking lots. Last one had thousands of vehicles. I had to get to job hours early to get a decent parking place. With the Smartcar I wait to near start time and get a spot everyone else past by for being too tight. Just right for Smart. I take small jobs sometimes, between large jobs. they are short shutdowns, days. I just stay in truck. Also we have 34kish in truck. That includes all mods I have done. I do get better mpg, not a lot, but is better. If I had gotten a 5500, it would have to be my daily commute. Did not want that. It would have to have air suspension. This would be a custom truck such as you have. 100k. We just didn't want to spend that kind of money. I have had to do some work on the HDT. I find it easy to work on. I can get to stuff. New trucks are a bear to work on. I also was able to convert to air over hydraulic disc brakes on Teton. Sweet setup. No wires going to them, just air. I have towed my Teton with a 3500. That was tense. Also I had an issues with my brakes a while back. One reason for brake upgrade. I disconnected and carried on with trip. I had ample brakes. Will the 5500 stop your weights with its brakes only? My 3500 would not.
Glenn, as you well stated, it depends, especially as pertains to a commute. We simply do have that work situation. I would posit most don't have your skill set to make the kind of cost effective modifications you have made or to work on an HDT. Obviously for you, at this stage, the HDT is a good choice.
As to the brake question: There is no argument an HDT will stop a trailer who's brakes are not operating better than a MDT like the 5500HD. That said, a friend with a 5500HD pulled his New Horizons some 500 miles to his home in Florida without any trailer brakes. He said he was fine. I take him at his word but I'd think twice about that even with an HDT. I once pulled ours a short distance without trailer brakes and, honestly, didn't notice at first they were not working. (They were purposefully disconnected for a dis-related reason and frankly it was a screw-up on my part. Another story - had to do with an ocean-going ferry trip.)
But no argument, the HDT will stop a trailer without brakes better then a 5500HD and a 3500 truck simply will not stop a 20K trailer in any reasonable distance. "Ask me how I know this" from experience.
All this said, we've just had "no drama" towing and stopping with the 5500HD and its a good choice - for us - for the criteria we set forth. For you the HDT is obviously a better choice. It all depends on one's overall criteria. Everything's a compromise someplace along the line.
Since there are a few Ram 5500 owners regularly on this forum I thought I would see if I could get a little feedback on insuring a Ram 5500 Hauler Truck. New Horizon Majestic is now complete and we have plans to head to Classy Chassis in approx three weeks to pick up our new Ram 5500 Hauler Truck and then over to New Horizon to pick up the new 5th wheel that is waiting. I am getting some push back from my insurance agent trying to obtain quotes for coverage on the truck. Safeco, my carrier for most of my insurance will not cover a truck such as this. There reason was size and cost, $100k. Would love to hear who some of you have your coverage through and what the annual cost is. My agent is reaching out to other carriers now. Trying to brace myself for the cost shock.
Thanks in advance for any feed back.
Depending on your state of residence this is either "oh my!" or no big deal. Contact Miller Insurance, Marlene J. Bounds, (503) 636-6347. They do this. Most local agents don't have the expertise or availability of insurance products to deal with commercial trucks in private use. Miller does. Not all agents have access to all products from underwriters - don't care what the agent says, they don't. ("Ask me how I know this.")
I know this sounds weird, but what you probably need is a "Motor Home" policy. That's what it is called and yes I know you're not purchasing a Motor Home. But Progressive, and others, have a policy that covers your trailer and truck independently, but if you do both with the same company the commercial truck rate is way less - depending on your home state - that's the sticky deal - your state. Our costs were actually far less on the Ram 5500HD then on the Chevy 3500HD - both trucks were built by Classy. Don't forget to insure for the full value with the up-fit, NOT just based on VIN number. Big difference.
PM me if you care to. As you can see by the sig we have a NH, Ram 5500HD and have tread this road before.
Thanks for your reply. Been following a few of you guys on here with same truck and trailers now for some time and felt sure i could get a little guidance from you guys. Initial quote from my agent was for truck coverage of $950/yr. After providing Vin# they came back with a refusal to insure due to truck type and size and cost. I felt sure that the initial quote was too low at $950 and am expecting much higher cost ultimately. I will reach out to the agent you noted and continue weeding through everything.
We are excited to get moving on picking up both the truck and 5th wheel next month. Kind of hate that the guys at NH finished the trailer ahead of schedule as it is now sitting in their parking lot (winterize of course) waiting to be picked up. Tom at CC says truck should be ready second week of Jan. Hopefully we will be lucky with the weather in Jan when we head up from Texas to pick everything up.
Thanks again,
Greg
Greg, have to chuckle a bit. We've picked up both our trucks from Tom in the snow. Actually needed the 4-WD coming home with the 5500HD.
If Tom says second week of Jan. bet it will be ready. One thing he does is not over promise and under deliver.
Suggest you plan on plenty of time at pickup of the NH. Don't leave till it is to your satisfaction. Much easier to get any new rig checked out at delivery rather than going back. It takes time to do a full checkout and the only way is to actually live it in a few days and try everything. A walk through just does't cut it with any new rig, NH included.
Let us know if we can help.
Bill
Big thanks to you for the heads up on Marlene at Miller Ins. Save me a substantial amount of money and hassle.
Happy Hilidays
Your most welcome - that was the goal. Marlene knows her stuff and they do know the RV / Truck / Motor Home business.
BTW, you need to catch up with the New Horizons Owners Group - NHOG for short. While we may be fewer in number we try to share info on the NH rigs. Search around for the names by sig. We also do a rally every 18 months. The last in Spearfish, SD was great. We all share info and fiddle with the trailers. Lots of little - sometimes big - things get fixed. Just get out your tool box and 6 people will show up ready to work. LOL
The next rally will be in the Spring of 2019 - no official date yet but before the heart of "official travel season" as Neil of "Neil and Connie" likes to say. "Lynn and Ed" who are on this forum are co-Rally masters with another couple whom I don't believe frequent here. All great people to be around.
Welcome to the group and the forum.
Bill
I guess I fall into that category of many RVer's that look at the HDT as a truck as one that will be a little more difficult to deal with when not towing. We live in Texas and spend two months a year in Colorado along with a few more outings per year but do not full time. Obviously my goal was to be able to pull the set up with plenty of safe capacity and both set ups would do that. Don't get me wrong, I think the HDT is an awesome set up but I just wanted a truck that would be a little more user friendly when not towing.
I do appreciate your point though.
Thanks
Glenn, this is a very good conversation to have and in some cases this is the old Ford/Chevy discussion on steroids. As I have discussed with Jack many times – in our case – it’s because we don’t want an HDT.
Here’s our reasons: Saying first off, I am licensed to drive an HDT, have a Class A, and drove them for business with 18 speed Fuller transmissions. So I know what I am talking about as pertains to the decision for us. It’s different for others. This is not an absolute.
1 – An HDT is not required for us. – My true Class V MDT – which most mistake for a luxury pickup till they see the insignia on the side – even with the 24,250 GVWR trailer, still has lots of capacity left. Beyond about 26,500 trailer GVW I would have an HDT – no question.
2 – The Ram fits in a garage. Yes, that matters to us. Not too many, but to us it does.
3 – There is most always a Ram (or Ford / Chevy) dealer around should service be required – especially true in Alaska and Canada. HDT parts and service are not as plentiful in an emergency for HDT’s. (“Ask me how I know this.”) And if necessary a “standard” wrecker can tow the 5500HD. Not so with an HDT.
4 – Even with air-ride seats and all in the HDT the Ram is simply more comfortable to ride in – especially solo. One can say this is opinion – agreed. But for us with full air-ride on the rear axle the Ram rides wonderfully solo and we don’t “bounce” as is the case with some air-ride seats.
5 – Parts and repairs, in many cases, are less money. (I acknowledge – “It depends.”)
6 – The Ram is a lot lower physically off the ground to get in. Today, this doesn’t matter as much; tomorrow it might. But for us it is much easier as a “grocery getter” and a touring vehicle.
7 – I can use the hauler bed as a pickup when desired and do so on a lot of occasions.
8 – We have no need / desire for a Smart Car hauler so the HDT isn’t necessary for that purpose.
9 – The true purchase costs for an HDT will be the same or more than the “$100K” Hauler Bed converted Class V, IMO. Not saying one can’t find a good used HDT for less. But when I have investigated, and I have, the cost difference just isn’t there for what we would purchase. Naturally YMMV depending on truck criteria.
10 – I can work on the Ram (or Ford or Chevy) with most basic tools and have some spares. I can change a tire in a pinch. Just can’t do that with an HDT. (Recall, I had HDT’s in a business environment.)
11 – I can enter any campground without concern because the MDT “looks” like a pickup. Some, not a lot, but some CG’s are not HDT friendly. I know there is an HDT friendly directory. Naturally YMMV.
12 – The new MDT Ram will last as long as we need. True, a relatively low mileage HDT can out last the Ram. But I don’t plan to drive the “million miles.” 300,000 should do us pretty well.
You said, don’t take the question to Glenn as criticism. I certainly didn’t. I consider this an important conversation to have for those reading along. I think for some HDT’s are without a doubt the best choice – many times the only choice. But there are good reasons some of us chose the MDT route. They just fit our needs much better and the cost difference between the used HDT and the new MDT simply wasn’t there for us. Again, a choice.
Bill
Just to add to Bill's comment, I also drove 18-wheelers in my past. For me, I would not want an HDT because of the visibility issues. With most HDT's, one has to rely on mirrors, and I really like being able to turn my head and look out windows to see, especially with regards to backing into an RV site at an angle.
Granted, our Mobile Suites is only 18,500 lbs when loaded, so our Ford F450 is plenty big enough for that.
Terry
Glenn, as you well stated, it depends, especially as pertains to a commute. We simply do have that work situation. I would posit most don't have your skill set to make the kind of cost effective modifications you have made or to work on an HDT. Obviously for you, at this stage, the HDT is a good choice.
As to the brake question: There is no argument an HDT will stop a trailer who's brakes are not operating better than a MDT like the 5500HD. That said, a friend with a 5500HD pulled his New Horizons some 500 miles to his home in Florida without any trailer brakes. He said he was fine. I take him at his word but I'd think twice about that even with an HDT. I once pulled ours a short distance without trailer brakes and, honestly, didn't notice at first they were not working. (They were purposefully disconnected for a dis-related reason and frankly it was a screw-up on my part. Another story - had to do with an ocean-going ferry trip.)
But no argument, the HDT will stop a trailer without brakes better then a 5500HD and a 3500 truck simply will not stop a 20K trailer in any reasonable distance. "Ask me how I know this" from experience.
All this said, we've just had "no drama" towing and stopping with the 5500HD and its a good choice - for us - for the criteria we set forth. For you the HDT is obviously a better choice. It all depends on one's overall criteria. Everything's a compromise someplace along the line.
Bill