We picked ours up yesterday…beautiful dark red and tan to match the rig…if you're interested in photos it's at http://guntherandkara.com.
What a nice truck…way more features and complex user comfort stuff than our old F450. We upgraded after 4 years due to 3 things…bed rail to bedroom clearance, rear axle capacity as our 450 was about 1800 pounds over with the aux tank installed…I know there's plenty of safety factor but we hated to be overweight even though it pulled and braked just fine, and lastly for the dry storage space in the hauler bed.
We're loving it already.
Judy L said
01:54 PM May 6, 2016
Nice truck! Congratulations and enjoy :)
TRAILERKING said
02:19 PM May 6, 2016
Now that's a Classy Chassis........Nice Rig.
Neil and Connie said
03:10 PM May 6, 2016
Thanks folks…we love it already. Judy…are you going to the NHOG rally week after next?
Judy L said
03:14 PM May 6, 2016
No, it didn't work out for us this year but we may get there next year. Have a good time!
Bill and Linda said
03:28 PM May 6, 2016
Man, that is one fine looking truck. You know, I'll be it tows and rides almost as good as ours. :) I know one thing for sure, you can't overload that one even with your trailer. Nice feeling, isn't it?
Based on your blog numbers and the known weight of the truck with Classy Chassis up-fit, even with 112 gallons of fuel, tools and stuff, you still have right at 2,000lbs of rear axle capacity remaining and 3,300lbs of GCVWR. Not one truck rating even close to limits. All in the 1,000's left over.
Like I told Linda with ours, Connie can now bring all her shoes without concern for overloading the truck. It's the shoes, you know, not our tools or heavy pin weights from batteries that overload trucks. Shoe loads are always a major concern. LOL
Enjoy the ride on those air springs.
Bill
Bobc said
04:53 PM May 6, 2016
Great truck Neil.
We also have the same truck thanks to Bill
We have only about 2000. Towing miles on ours and it has been great. We don't even know the trailer is there most of the time I can not say enough good things about it
Neil and Connie said
06:57 PM May 7, 2016
Bill and Linda wrote:
Man, that is one fine looking truck. You know, I'll be it tows and rides almost as good as ours. :) I know one thing for sure, you can't overload that one even with your trailer. Nice feeling, isn't it?
Based on your blog numbers and the known weight of the truck with Classy Chassis up-fit, even with 112 gallons of fuel, tools and stuff, you still have right at 2,000lbs of rear axle capacity remaining and 3,300lbs of GCVWR. Not one truck rating even close to limits. All in the 1,000's left over.
Like I told Linda with ours, Connie can now bring all her shoes without concern for overloading the truck. It's the shoes, you know, not our tools or heavy pin weights from batteries that overload trucks. Shoe loads are always a major concern. LOL
Enjoy the ride on those air springs.
Bill
You're right…shoe loads are important…but we already had all of Connie's onboard. Certainly can't overload it. We went on a 90 minute ride today to finish recharging the batteries…running at 14 volts all the way on the battery voltage so I think the dead battery problem is behind us (for those who weren't on our email chain the truck was delivered to Classy right around the first of the year and was back from fabrication in Elkhart in early Feb…it's basically been sitting at Classy for 3 months and with all the in/out of the shop for work, equipment installs, and demo when we picked it up the batteries were low enough so the low voltage limit circuit kept it from cranking. 15 or so hours on the battery charger and the highway speed drive seems to have resolved it.
We haven't towed yet…but I"m sure we will like just as Bobc and Bill/Linda to.
deminimis said
04:19 PM May 11, 2016
Are you guys stuck with paying commercial vehicle insurance like me?
-- Edited by deminimis on Wednesday 11th of May 2016 04:26:07 PM
Rickl said
04:24 PM May 11, 2016
You might want to check around on insurance. Miller out of Oregon told me that they consider that size as RV, not commercial as I asked so I didn't run into that issue. I still haven't pulled the trigger on a truck yet, but will definitely be going with Miller once I have everything set.
I am sure others will chime in and it'll probably be all across the board.
deminimis said
04:28 PM May 11, 2016
Well I'm in Oregon. So, Miller Insurance? I assume in Portland?? Only thing I found that was cheaper than my commercial policy through State Farm was to insure it as a RV. That doesn't work for us as we often don't have the camper on it. Thanks!
Bobc said
04:49 PM May 11, 2016
We had to register and insure as a commercial vehicle here in Mass. Cost me a small fortune. Registration was not to bad
Bill and Linda said
07:09 AM May 12, 2016
As to insurance cost for class 4 and above trucks: it depends on your state of residence. We are able, through Miller / Progressive to insure the truck AND trailer as a package and get a "motorhome rate" for the truck. Hard to believe but we pay less to insure the class 5 MDT truck then we did the class 3 truck and the MDT naturally cost more. This policy isn't available in some states and Bobc's is one of those states. Some insurance companies don't do business in some states. As to registration, the truck is registered as a private vehicle but we do have to pay a road use weight tax for the tag. But we had to do that for the class 3 truck as well. It's that sate of residence thing again.
dianneandsteve said
10:11 AM May 12, 2016
Sweet ride!
Neil and Connie said
02:09 PM May 12, 2016
>>comercial insurance
Not me…USAA was happy to cover it for me although I do pay more because of the weight but it's still covered on my regular policy with them. We had a couple of back and forth discussions on it…they first sent me to the commercial people since it was a 5500…but the commercial folks said we don't do it for private use even though it's technically a commercial truck. So back to the regular insurance folks…and the guy I was talking with was an RVer, saw I had been with for 40 years and wanted to figure out a way to make it work. He was concerned that they didn't have the right underwriting tables and such originally but agreed that the 5500 was a much safer tow vehicle than our previous 450…and after talking to the underwriters they basically told him it was his decision as the policy writer…and given all the research he had done and documented in our file he was happy to add it for us. We ended up paying about $175 or $200 more a year for it vs the 450…but it's a weight based thing.
Bill and Linda said
03:13 PM May 12, 2016
Neil and Connie wrote:
>>comercial insurance
Not me…USAA was happy to cover it for me although I do pay more because of the weight but it's still covered on my regular policy with them. We had a couple of back and forth discussions on it…they first sent me to the commercial people since it was a 5500…but the commercial folks said we don't do it for private use even though it's technically a commercial truck. So back to the regular insurance folks…and the guy I was talking with was an RVer, saw I had been with for 40 years and wanted to figure out a way to make it work. He was concerned that they didn't have the right underwriting tables and such originally but agreed that the 5500 was a much safer tow vehicle than our previous 450…and after talking to the underwriters they basically told him it was his decision as the policy writer…and given all the research he had done and documented in our file he was happy to add it for us. We ended up paying about $175 or $200 more a year for it vs the 450…but it's a weight based thing.
That's interesting. They agreed the larger, more capable, albeit more expensive truck, is actually safer. I ran into another agent / adjuster like that with Progressive. Sometimes it works out. But its still a state thing as to a company doing business in your state of residency. Neil's in a "good state."
Bill
Bobc said
03:18 PM May 12, 2016
Progressive would not do a policy in Mass.
safety insurance was the only one that would right it.
So 0 competition and a outrageous price.
Neil and Connie said
06:39 PM May 12, 2016
Bill and Linda wrote:
That's interesting. They agreed the larger, more capable, albeit more expensive truck, is actually safer. I ran into another agent / adjuster like that with Progressive. Sometimes it works out. But its still a state thing as to a company doing business in your state of residency. Neil's in a "good state."
Yeah…what it eventually came down to was that despite the truck 'technically' not being able to be insured by USAA the agent was able to use common sense to actually write the coverage anyway. He did say that at some point in the future there was a slight chance it would be denied for renewal but he doubted it would happen as he well documented the why's and wherefore's in our file.
Miller would have been able to cover us as well…but we would have had to move the rig from the USAA/Progressive partnership to Progressive through Miller and the extra 200 bucks for that basically counteracted the savings Miller had for the truck with Progressive.
It was nice to see common sense apply for a change…luckily the agent was an RVer and understood the truck capability and safety difference and was willing to stick his neck out a little to do what was obviously the right thing.
Cummins12V98 said
06:42 PM May 12, 2016
There is a reason the RAM 3500 and F450 both have 14K GVWR and not 14,001! Class 3.
Ray and Betty said
06:21 AM May 13, 2016
Neil, we also have our Ram 5500 w/Classy Chassis with now 4,200 miles on her. We also owe our thanks to Bill & Linda for the choice. We picked ours up on March 14 and drove it directly to South Carolina to pick up our new to us 2013 37 Majestic New Horizons and then on to Stuart, Florida. We absolutely love both. We just finish a week seminar with RV Dreamers at River Plantation RV Resort, Tennessee. At the moment were at Doll Mountain National Park in Northern Georgia (one of the nicest place we have stayed). Sunday, 5-15 we leave for the New Horizons Rendezvous in Georgia. I know Bill is going and hope to see you there.
The name on the license plate number which is on order is RAD RAM, Betty came up with this because my Initials our RAD.
Cummins12V98 said
07:17 PM May 13, 2016
Ray and Betty wrote:
Neil, we also have our Ram 5500 w/Classy Chassis with now 4,200 miles on her. We also owe our thanks to Bill & Linda for the choice. We picked ours up on March 14 and drove it directly to South Carolina to pick up our new to us 2013 37 Majestic New Horizons and then on to Stuart, Florida. We absolutely love both. We just finish a week seminar with RV Dreamers at River Plantation RV Resort, Tennessee. At the moment were at Doll Mountain National Park in Northern Georgia (one of the nicest place we have stayed). Sunday, 5-15 we leave for the New Horizons Rendezvous in Georgia. I know Bill is going and hope to see you there. The name on the license plate number which is on order is RAD RAM, Betty came up with this because my Initials our RAD.
What is the weight of your New Horizons fully loaded?
Neil and Connie said
05:37 PM May 14, 2016
We'll see ya'll at the rally tomorrow.
Neil and Connie said
12:44 PM May 31, 2016
Guess I'll go ahead and close out this thread with a report on the new truck's performance. Bill and Linda have the same truck from Classy Chassis as does Ray Danet.
We've towed 6 days so far…Hanna IN to Chattanooga and back and Hanna to Fairfax VA. The former was mostly flat but the latter was over on 70 and 68 which have some significant grades…6% down for 13 miles, a couple of 10-11% ones that were fairly short and even one short 13% grade.
Going uphill…the 5500 actually ends up at a lower stable speed than our old F450 did…but that's just a function of the 4.88 rear end and the way the torque curve on the Cummins diesel is I think. Plenty of power but on the one long 11% one we were doing a steady 41 up at 2600ish rpm.
Going downhill…I never really worried about it with the F450 but one did need to downshift and get ahold of the speed at the top of the hill…and then brake periodically on the way down. Coast up to 66-68, brake to 50, rinse and repeat. Usually I was braking every 1/2 to 3/4 of a mile on the way down. With the 5500…unless it was over 8% I just stayed in cruise control, the engine shifted down, the exhaust brake kicked in and maintained speed with no brakes at all. Over 8% I did have to brake but more like every mile or mile and a quarter depending…I'm guessing that if I had started at a lower speed at the top then the gearing would have kept me from having to brake much at all.
Just no drama with the new truck…as I said the 450 was fine but you did have to pay attention to it…but the 5500 just handles it.
Mileage wise…I've only got 2600 or so miles on it yet but averaging right at 8 miles per gallon overall with about 7.7 on the trip over here to VA that had the hills on it.
Bill and I have also found that full on the DEF gauge isn't really full…there's a lot of air space in the top of the tank since DEF is mostly water to allow for any freezing in cold climates. If you're in the warm weather you can fill it to the cutoff on the pump and get about 3-3.5 gallons past the 'full' mark. Bill reported that as soon as the gauge comes off the peg it took 4.3 gallons to the auto cutoff on the pump…so essentially if it's reading anything less than full one of the standard 2.5 gallon containers will fit nicely. The other thing is…get one of the little DEF magnet thingies that goes over the Pilot DEF pump or otherwise it goes really, really, really slow…like a gallon every 3-3.5 minutes…any faster and it cuts off since the truck (at least the 2016 model) has a plastic fill pipe and the DEF pump doesn't sense it. DEF is definitely cheaper via bulk fill at a truck stop…and if we're getting fuel on the road we go in there anyway as it's easier to get in/out than a regular gas station is with the rig in tow.
The air suspension Classy installs (Link Ultraride) is very nice…it completely replaces the OEM rear suspension and provides a very smooth ride. The bed itself is very nice as anybody that's seen Classy's work can attest to…lots of dry (well, almost dry but they don't guarantee it) storage. I was able to get my PressurePro tire pressure monitor sensors mounted on all the tires…you just have to make sure the valve stem is in the right place on the wheel and then slip your hand in between the inner and outer dualley wheels which are farther apart than they were on my old 450 or Bill's old 3500HD so you can actually get your hand in between them pretty easily…it's just a matter of making sure you have the stem properly positioned to screw the sensors on as your hand doesn't have much maneuverability once you get it in between the tires.
We transplanted my camera system, brake controller for the Tuson ABS on our rig, and Trailer Saver TSLB2 hitch over to the new truck…and I found out that New Horizons did not install the optional shock absorber on the hitch when they originally installed it. Talking to Tom from Classy…he recommended adding it as it definitely helps dampen out any hitch bouncing. It's not on the website at Hensley Mfg that makes the hitch…you have to call and order them from the office. The number is (800) 410-6580 and the part number for them is 45001 at $72.50 plus shipping. It's not really a kit…just the two shock absorbers, mounting bolts, and appropriate spacers.
The aux fuel tank system pumps pretty aggressively…keeping the main OEM tank >7/8 full at all times until the aux tank is empty. I actually prefer the way it works because if you have an issue with the aux tank pump you actually have more usable fuel in the OEM tank than I had on the F450. The TransferFlow tank I put in there kept the main and aux tanks at the same percentage full number.
All in all we're more than satisfied with the new truck…it does have some drawbacks compared to the F450; slower acceleration, a little worse mileage, and slower uphill performance…but the weight capacity, real exhaust brake, much heavier wheel braking capability, and the extras that the bed provide make it a definitely worthwhile upgrade.
We picked ours up yesterday…beautiful dark red and tan to match the rig…if you're interested in photos it's at http://guntherandkara.com.
What a nice truck…way more features and complex user comfort stuff than our old F450. We upgraded after 4 years due to 3 things…bed rail to bedroom clearance, rear axle capacity as our 450 was about 1800 pounds over with the aux tank installed…I know there's plenty of safety factor but we hated to be overweight even though it pulled and braked just fine, and lastly for the dry storage space in the hauler bed.
We're loving it already.
Nice truck! Congratulations and enjoy :)
Thanks folks…we love it already. Judy…are you going to the NHOG rally week after next?
No, it didn't work out for us this year but we may get there next year. Have a good time!
Man, that is one fine looking truck. You know, I'll be it tows and rides almost as good as ours. :) I know one thing for sure, you can't overload that one even with your trailer. Nice feeling, isn't it?
Based on your blog numbers and the known weight of the truck with Classy Chassis up-fit, even with 112 gallons of fuel, tools and stuff, you still have right at 2,000lbs of rear axle capacity remaining and 3,300lbs of GCVWR. Not one truck rating even close to limits. All in the 1,000's left over.
Like I told Linda with ours, Connie can now bring all her shoes without concern for overloading the truck. It's the shoes, you know, not our tools or heavy pin weights from batteries that overload trucks. Shoe loads are always a major concern. LOL
Enjoy the ride on those air springs.
Bill
We also have the same truck thanks to Bill
We have only about 2000. Towing miles on ours and it has been great. We don't even know the trailer is there most of the time I can not say enough good things about it
You're right…shoe loads are important…but we already had all of Connie's onboard. Certainly can't overload it. We went on a 90 minute ride today to finish recharging the batteries…running at 14 volts all the way on the battery voltage so I think the dead battery problem is behind us (for those who weren't on our email chain the truck was delivered to Classy right around the first of the year and was back from fabrication in Elkhart in early Feb…it's basically been sitting at Classy for 3 months and with all the in/out of the shop for work, equipment installs, and demo when we picked it up the batteries were low enough so the low voltage limit circuit kept it from cranking. 15 or so hours on the battery charger and the highway speed drive seems to have resolved it.
We haven't towed yet…but I"m sure we will like just as Bobc and Bill/Linda to.
Are you guys stuck with paying commercial vehicle insurance like me?
-- Edited by deminimis on Wednesday 11th of May 2016 04:26:07 PM
I am sure others will chime in and it'll probably be all across the board.
As to insurance cost for class 4 and above trucks: it depends on your state of residence. We are able, through Miller / Progressive to insure the truck AND trailer as a package and get a "motorhome rate" for the truck. Hard to believe but we pay less to insure the class 5 MDT truck then we did the class 3 truck and the MDT naturally cost more. This policy isn't available in some states and Bobc's is one of those states. Some insurance companies don't do business in some states. As to registration, the truck is registered as a private vehicle but we do have to pay a road use weight tax for the tag. But we had to do that for the class 3 truck as well. It's that sate of residence thing again.
Sweet ride!
>>comercial insurance
Not me…USAA was happy to cover it for me although I do pay more because of the weight but it's still covered on my regular policy with them. We had a couple of back and forth discussions on it…they first sent me to the commercial people since it was a 5500…but the commercial folks said we don't do it for private use even though it's technically a commercial truck. So back to the regular insurance folks…and the guy I was talking with was an RVer, saw I had been with for 40 years and wanted to figure out a way to make it work. He was concerned that they didn't have the right underwriting tables and such originally but agreed that the 5500 was a much safer tow vehicle than our previous 450…and after talking to the underwriters they basically told him it was his decision as the policy writer…and given all the research he had done and documented in our file he was happy to add it for us. We ended up paying about $175 or $200 more a year for it vs the 450…but it's a weight based thing.
That's interesting. They agreed the larger, more capable, albeit more expensive truck, is actually safer. I ran into another agent / adjuster like that with Progressive. Sometimes it works out. But its still a state thing as to a company doing business in your state of residency. Neil's in a "good state."
Bill
safety insurance was the only one that would right it.
So 0 competition and a outrageous price.
Yeah…what it eventually came down to was that despite the truck 'technically' not being able to be insured by USAA the agent was able to use common sense to actually write the coverage anyway. He did say that at some point in the future there was a slight chance it would be denied for renewal but he doubted it would happen as he well documented the why's and wherefore's in our file.
Miller would have been able to cover us as well…but we would have had to move the rig from the USAA/Progressive partnership to Progressive through Miller and the extra 200 bucks for that basically counteracted the savings Miller had for the truck with Progressive.
It was nice to see common sense apply for a change…luckily the agent was an RVer and understood the truck capability and safety difference and was willing to stick his neck out a little to do what was obviously the right thing.
What is the weight of your New Horizons fully loaded?
We'll see ya'll at the rally tomorrow.
Guess I'll go ahead and close out this thread with a report on the new truck's performance. Bill and Linda have the same truck from Classy Chassis as does Ray Danet.
We've towed 6 days so far…Hanna IN to Chattanooga and back and Hanna to Fairfax VA. The former was mostly flat but the latter was over on 70 and 68 which have some significant grades…6% down for 13 miles, a couple of 10-11% ones that were fairly short and even one short 13% grade.
Going uphill…the 5500 actually ends up at a lower stable speed than our old F450 did…but that's just a function of the 4.88 rear end and the way the torque curve on the Cummins diesel is I think. Plenty of power but on the one long 11% one we were doing a steady 41 up at 2600ish rpm.
Going downhill…I never really worried about it with the F450 but one did need to downshift and get ahold of the speed at the top of the hill…and then brake periodically on the way down. Coast up to 66-68, brake to 50, rinse and repeat. Usually I was braking every 1/2 to 3/4 of a mile on the way down. With the 5500…unless it was over 8% I just stayed in cruise control, the engine shifted down, the exhaust brake kicked in and maintained speed with no brakes at all. Over 8% I did have to brake but more like every mile or mile and a quarter depending…I'm guessing that if I had started at a lower speed at the top then the gearing would have kept me from having to brake much at all.
Just no drama with the new truck…as I said the 450 was fine but you did have to pay attention to it…but the 5500 just handles it.
Mileage wise…I've only got 2600 or so miles on it yet but averaging right at 8 miles per gallon overall with about 7.7 on the trip over here to VA that had the hills on it.
Bill and I have also found that full on the DEF gauge isn't really full…there's a lot of air space in the top of the tank since DEF is mostly water to allow for any freezing in cold climates. If you're in the warm weather you can fill it to the cutoff on the pump and get about 3-3.5 gallons past the 'full' mark. Bill reported that as soon as the gauge comes off the peg it took 4.3 gallons to the auto cutoff on the pump…so essentially if it's reading anything less than full one of the standard 2.5 gallon containers will fit nicely. The other thing is…get one of the little DEF magnet thingies that goes over the Pilot DEF pump or otherwise it goes really, really, really slow…like a gallon every 3-3.5 minutes…any faster and it cuts off since the truck (at least the 2016 model) has a plastic fill pipe and the DEF pump doesn't sense it. DEF is definitely cheaper via bulk fill at a truck stop…and if we're getting fuel on the road we go in there anyway as it's easier to get in/out than a regular gas station is with the rig in tow.
The air suspension Classy installs (Link Ultraride) is very nice…it completely replaces the OEM rear suspension and provides a very smooth ride. The bed itself is very nice as anybody that's seen Classy's work can attest to…lots of dry (well, almost dry but they don't guarantee it) storage. I was able to get my PressurePro tire pressure monitor sensors mounted on all the tires…you just have to make sure the valve stem is in the right place on the wheel and then slip your hand in between the inner and outer dualley wheels which are farther apart than they were on my old 450 or Bill's old 3500HD so you can actually get your hand in between them pretty easily…it's just a matter of making sure you have the stem properly positioned to screw the sensors on as your hand doesn't have much maneuverability once you get it in between the tires.
We transplanted my camera system, brake controller for the Tuson ABS on our rig, and Trailer Saver TSLB2 hitch over to the new truck…and I found out that New Horizons did not install the optional shock absorber on the hitch when they originally installed it. Talking to Tom from Classy…he recommended adding it as it definitely helps dampen out any hitch bouncing. It's not on the website at Hensley Mfg that makes the hitch…you have to call and order them from the office. The number is (800) 410-6580 and the part number for them is 45001 at $72.50 plus shipping. It's not really a kit…just the two shock absorbers, mounting bolts, and appropriate spacers.
The aux fuel tank system pumps pretty aggressively…keeping the main OEM tank >7/8 full at all times until the aux tank is empty. I actually prefer the way it works because if you have an issue with the aux tank pump you actually have more usable fuel in the OEM tank than I had on the F450. The TransferFlow tank I put in there kept the main and aux tanks at the same percentage full number.
All in all we're more than satisfied with the new truck…it does have some drawbacks compared to the F450; slower acceleration, a little worse mileage, and slower uphill performance…but the weight capacity, real exhaust brake, much heavier wheel braking capability, and the extras that the bed provide make it a definitely worthwhile upgrade.