We have ordered an Arctic Fox 32-5M (GVWR 16,500) and a 2016 F-450 (GVWR 14,000), total combined GVWR 30,500.  I have been getting conflicting information (even from the local drivers license office) in regards to an additional endorsement on my Florida DL.  In general, any combination greater than 26,000 GVWR requires a Class A endorsement in Florida.  However, there appears to be an exception for RVs (which includes trailers and fifth wheels).

Does anyone have some experience in Florida in this regards they could share?

I did send an e-mail to the Florida Department of Highway Safety asking for clarification, but I am not sure when they will respond.

In addition, I have researched the Florida Statutes and have come to my own conclusion, but don't want to solely rely on that.

We will share our details about our new rig and truck a little later when everything falls into place.

A CDL (Commercial Driver License) is as the name implies for commercial use. Florida has only the E class for non commercial use.
I am a Florida resident and my camper is over 22K and my F450 is at 11K and I don't need  a Class A. Recently I down graded my Class A license to a Class E since I no longer drive commercial vehicles.

From the Florida official website at: https://www.flhsmv.gov/ddl/dlclass.html

The following persons are exempt from the requirements to obtain a commercial driver license:

Drivers of authorized emergency vehicles that are equipped with extraordinary audible warning devices that display red or blue lights and are on call to respond to emergencies;or
Military personnel driving military vehicles; or
Farmers transporting farm supplies or farm machinery, or transporting agricultural products to or from the first place of storage or processing or directly to or from market, within 150 miles of their farm; or
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Drivers of recreational vehicles used for recreational purposes
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Drivers who operate straight trucks (single units) that are exclusively transporting their own tangible personal property which is not for sale.
An employee of a publicly owned transit system who is limited to moving vehicles for maintenance or parking purposes exclusively within the restricted-access confines of a transit system's property.

-- Edited by R12 on Wednesday 24th of February 2016 10:38:41 AM

No personal experience, but it seems pretty clear from this Official Page About Drivers Licenses.

The Class A endorsement you referred to is listed under the Commercial Drivers License (CDL) section.  In most states, CDL requirements don't apply to RVs used for recreational purposes, and in Florida in particular, the CDL Expemptions are listed on the same page

CDL Exemptions

The following persons are exempt from the requirements to obtain a commercial driver license:

Sorry for the duplicate info.  Looks like I was drafting my post when Paul beat me to it.  :)

The OP question concerned Florida.  But may I advise (warn) those in other states that some states require a non-commercial Class A or B even for some RV’s based on weight and type. Mine requires a Class “A” for my rig due to weight and it being a “towed vehicle.”

You will find most states exempt RV’s from the commercial (CDL) requirements.  But they still require a Class “B” or Class “A” test that does not contain the “commercial” material. This includes a driving test with a vehicle appropriate to the class applied for.

It’s very easy to read the regulations, see “RV’s exempt” and think - “All good!” Then comes the fine print later on the regulations.  “Ask me how I know this.”

Driving with the wrong class of license is the same as driving without a license.  Just saying . . .

Bill and Linda wrote:

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Driving with the wrong class of license is the same as driving without a license.  Just saying . . .

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 Especially if get into a fender bender.

Thanks for confirming my thoughts. I really appreciate hearing from those of you that been through this.  I had someone at the DMV tell me one thing then when I challenged her she changed her answer. Also, her "paper" book did not list RVs as exempt, but when she went online and reviewed her reference material she found the RV exemption.

Below is my research of the state statutes, and I agree that you have to be very careful when coming up with a conclusion. For example, if somehow a fifth wheel in setup mode exceeds 400 sq. ft, you do need the Class A endorsement.  I just wanted to share the details in case at some point in time later on, someone else goes through the same challenges with the DMV. And, I an still waiting to hear from the Florida Department of Highway Safety with a written response.

Here are the Florida Statutes that address Drivers License Classifications. I have removed some verbiage for ease of reading. I have bolded information that I thought was mostly relevant.

 322.54Classification.—
 (1)Except as provided in s. 322.53, effective April 1, 1992, a person may not drive any motor vehicle not authorized by the classification of his or her driver license.
 (2)The department shall issue, pursuant to the requirements of this chapter, driver licenses in accordance with the following classifications:
 (a)Any person who drives a motor vehicle combination having a gross vehicle weight rating or gross vehicle weight of 26,001 pounds or more must possess a valid Class A driver license, if the gross vehicle weight rating or gross vehicle weight of the vehicle being towed is more than 10,000 pounds.
 (b)Any person, except a person who possesses a valid Class A driver license, who drives a motor vehicle having a gross vehicle weight rating or gross vehicle weight of 26,001 pounds or more must possess a valid Class B driver license. Any person, except a person who possesses a valid Class A driver license, who drives such vehicle towing a vehicle having a gross vehicle weight rating of 10,000 pounds or less must possess a valid Class B driver license.
 (c)Any person, except a person who possesses a valid Class A or a valid Class B driver license, who drives a motor vehicle having a gross vehicle weight rating of less than 26,001 pounds and who is required to obtain an endorsement pursuant to paragraph (1)(b), paragraph (1)(c), or paragraph (1)(e) of s. 322.57, must possess a valid Class C driver license.
 (d)Any person, except a person who possesses a valid Class A, valid Class B, or valid Class C driver license, who drives a motor vehicle must possess a valid Class E driver license. (Class E is the normal DL in Florida)

The way I read the above, none of the Class A, B or C driver license applies if you meet one of the exemptions noted in s. 322.53.

322.53 License required; exemptions.—
 (1)Except as provided in subsection (2), every person who drives a commercial motor vehicle in this state is required to possess a valid commercial driver license issued in accordance with the requirements of this chapter.
 2)The following persons are exempt from the requirement to obtain a commercial driver license:
 (a)Drivers of authorized emergency vehicles.
 (b)Military personnel driving vehicles operated for military purposes.
 (c)Farmers transporting agricultural products, farm supplies, or farm machinery to or from their farms and within 150 miles of their farms, if the vehicle operated under this exemption is not used in the operations of a common or contract motor carrier.
 (d)Drivers of recreational vehicles, as defined in s. 320.01.
 (e)Drivers who operate straight trucks, as defined in s. 316.003, and who are transporting exclusively their own tangible personal property, which is not for sale.
 (f)Employees of a publicly owned transit system who are limited to moving vehicles for maintenance or parking purposes exclusively within the restricted-access confines of a transit system’s property.

So RV's are exempt if the meet the definition in s. 320.01

 320.01Definitions, general.—As used in the Florida Statutes
 (b)A recreational vehicle-type unit primarily designed as temporary living quarters for recreational, camping, or travel use, which either has its own motive power or is mounted on or drawn by another vehicle. Recreational vehicle-type units, when traveling on the public roadways of this state, must comply with the length and width provisions of s. 316.515, as that section may hereafter be amended. As defined below, the basic entities are:
 1.The “travel trailer,” which is a vehicular portable unit, mounted on wheels, of such a size or weight as not to require special highway movement permits when drawn by a motorized vehicle. It is primarily designed and constructed to provide temporary living quarters for recreational, camping, or travel use. It has a body width of no more than 81/2 feet and an overall body length of no more than 40 feet when factory-equipped for the road.
 2.The “camping trailer,” which is a vehicular portable unit mounted on wheels and constructed with collapsible partial sidewalls which fold for towing by another vehicle and unfold at the campsite to provide temporary living quarters for recreational, camping, or travel use.
 3.The “truck camper,” which is a truck equipped with a portable unit designed to be loaded onto, or affixed to, the bed or chassis of the truck and constructed to provide temporary living quarters for recreational, camping, or travel use.
 4.The “motor home,” which is a vehicular unit which does not exceed the length, height, and width limitations provided in s. 316.515, is a self-propelled motor vehicle, and is primarily designed to provide temporary living quarters for recreational, camping, or travel use.
 5.The “private motor coach,” which is a vehicular unit which does not exceed the length, width, and height limitations provided in s. 316.515(9), is built on a self-propelled bus type chassis having no fewer than three load-bearing axles, and is primarily designed to provide temporary living quarters for recreational, camping, or travel use.
 6.The “van conversion,” which is a vehicular unit which does not exceed the length and width limitations provided in s. 316.515, is built on a self-propelled motor vehicle chassis, and is designed for recreation, camping, and travel use.
 7.The “park trailer,” which is a transportable unit which has a body width not exceeding 14 feet and which is built on a single chassis and is designed to provide seasonal or temporary living quarters when connected to utilities necessary for operation of installed fixtures and appliances. The total area of the unit in a setup mode, when measured from the exterior surface of the exterior stud walls at the level of maximum dimensions, not including any bay window, does not exceed 400 square feet when constructed to ANSI A-119.5 standards, and 500 square feet when constructed to United States Department of Housing and Urban Development Standards. The length of a park trailer means the distance from the exterior of the front of the body (nearest to the drawbar and coupling mechanism) to the exterior of the rear of the body (at the opposite end of the body), including any protrusions.
 8.The “fifth-wheel trailer,” which is a vehicular unit mounted on wheels, designed to provide temporary living quarters for recreational, camping, or travel use, of such size or weight as not to require a special highway movement permit, of gross trailer area not to exceed 400 square feet in the setup mode, and designed to be towed by a motorized vehicle that contains a towing mechanism that is mounted above or forward of the tow vehicle’s rear axle.

The Arctic Fox 32-5M is approx 300 sq ft set up.
Therefore, my conclusion is that I do not need anything other than a Class E (normal D.L.) in Florida.

David:

Thanks for posting those Florida regulations.  The 400 sq. ft. in the "setup mode" (i.e. the slides out) as well as the 40 foot length limitation for the Class A exemption caught my eye.  I had not seen those before.

With the size of many rigs now it is not that hard for a 5th wheel to be over 40 feet long.

I'll file that detail away.

FWIW, when I was doing the research on this some years ago for my home state I finally had to call the state DMV for clarification.  Speaking with the head guy at the capital he commented that few people realize they are pulling RVs without a valid license.  Even the DMV offices don't understand the law but that does not exempt the operator of the vehicle.

Bill

Dave, I'd agree with your interpretation. No length spec was mentioned for 5er trailers.

Dave and Denise wrote:

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Bill,
Oddly enough I think a 5th wheel exceeding 40ft is OK as long as it is less than the 400 sq. ft. setup rule. I believe the 40ft restriction only applies to a "travel trailer". But, hey I am not a paid attorney interpreting these things! :)

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Dave:

Your correct.  A 40' 5th wheel isn't actually 40' long on the road anyway and somewhere in my cloudy memory I recall that travel trailer deal as to length. 

Good point and thanks for that comment.  Nice for us to "get it right."  Enough incorrect information floats around as it is on this subject.

"It takes a village."

Bill

After several attempts I have received a written response from the Florida Department of Safety and Motor Vehicles. I must tell you, that during the process I had several customer service representatives tell me I needed a CDL Class A license for our 30,500 lb setup. But each time when I challenged them about possible exemptions for an RV they either backed off, agreed with me or referred me to another individual.

Below is the response I received which is in agreement with the posts made by Howard and Paul.

CUSTOMER SERVICE RESPONSE: As stated, FS 322.53 exempts drivers of RV’s as defined in FS 320.01 from the requirements to have a CDL. Below are the excepts from FS 320.01(1)(b) that based on the question are relevant. FS 320.01(1)(b) A recreational vehicle-type unit primarily designed as temporary living quarters for recreational, camping, or travel use, which either has its own motive power or is mounted on or drawn by another vehicle. Recreational vehicle-type units, when traveling on the public roadways of this state, must comply with the length and width provisions of s. 316.515, as that section may hereafter be amended. As defined below, the basic entities are: FS 320.01(1)(b)(8) 8. The “fifth-wheel trailer,” which is a vehicular unit mounted on wheels, designed to provide temporary living quarters for recreational, camping, or travel use, of such size or weight as not to require a special highway movement permit, of gross trailer area not to exceed 400 square feet in the setup mode, and designed to be towed by a motorized vehicle that contains a towing mechanism that is mounted above or forward of the tow vehicle’s rear axle. As long as the vehicle meets these requirements then the driver is exempt from the requirements to have a CDL to operate the combination vehicle. We hope this information is of assistance to you.

I sincerely appreciate having such a great forum to post this type of question and get timely accurate answers.

Thanks!

Great question - and answers.

When I moved to Florida a little over a year ago, they wouldn't let me keep my CDL A because I didn't have a current medical card. At the time I was told I did not need a class A to haul my fifth-wheel. Guess I should've asked about size requirements.

To stay legal with my current fifth-wheel, I have to go pay for the physical and an extra $81.25 for my license which will now renew every four years instead of when the current one does in 2023.

Who says size doesn't matter, LOL 

Off to make some appointments, thanks again for the information!

Sean,
I think given your situation you are making the right decision. Hopefully a physical, and less than $100 will never come into play...but if it did and you were illegal...well, you know the potential devastating ramifications.