Hi Howard, I know you have great expertise in researching various issues. My concern is, as an early retireee, I have been relying on ACA, which at least provides catastrophic health insurance coverage, if not much else, and the premiums have been manageable. However, as pensions and SS kick in and income rises, the cost will become a very significant portion of my income, again for poor coverage. Not a concern to those past 65, but for those under, it's a big deal.
Have you run across any movement or groups of health-care 'refugees' setting up domicile in Canada?
-- Edited by melody on Monday 22nd of February 2016 07:39:12 PM
ticat900 said
07:52 PM Feb 22, 2016
simply put there is no such thing. The only way for a non cdn citizen to get free health care in Canada is claim your a Syrian refugee (lol)
I have edited this post because of the confusion . I should have included ""permanent resident"" also can get health care
one of the reasons we have such a drain on our system is many many people have come to Canada over the years under refugee status
and they take a toll on our entire welfare system(tax payers pay)
99% of the born and raised all work and contribute as they should and they are certainly not the problem as others suggest
-- Edited by ticat900 on Tuesday 23rd of February 2016 06:56:12 PM
TRAILERKING said
10:47 PM Feb 22, 2016
melody wrote:
Have you run across any movement or groups of health-care 'refugees' setting up domicile in Canada?
What about us up here setting up a Domicile in the U.S.??? Is that possible?
legrandnormand said
08:17 AM Feb 23, 2016
NO WAY on both sides... unless you are a refugee !
Howard said
09:06 AM Feb 23, 2016
Melody,
I haven't heard of any groups setting up domicile in Canada, although I did some poking around to see what it might entail.
In order to be eligible for Canada's healthcare program you need to be classified as a "Permanent Resident"; Citizenship is not required.
But "Permanent Resident" status is not easy to obtain if you are a retiree. There are over 60 programs for immigration to Canada, but most of them are for professionals, skilled workers, business owners, or self-employed individuals - those that tend to present the ability to make a positive economic impact (Economic Classes of immigrants). There are also some "Family Class Sponsorships" that are available if you have close relatives in Canada and there are a few other social or humanitarian programs (Non-Economic Classes), but they often require that your "Sponsor" has the economic means to support you.
So that would be the biggest hurdle for you as a retiree. It's much easier for those that move to Canada to work or produce income within the country (there is an "Express Entry" program for certain Economic Classes of immigrants).
Those that are able to gain "Permanent Resident" status just have to be present in Canada for 730 days (two years) out the most recent five years (or be able to show an ability to meet that requirement) to maintain it. HOWEVER, though "Permanent Residents" are generally eligible for Canada's healthcare, you still must meet stricter "presence" requirements to receive services. Each province has its own healthcare plan, and most of them require you to be present IN THE PROVINCE for at least 183 days each year to receive services.
The reverse of the above is pretty much true for Canadians coming to the U.S. With a few special exceptions, you must be sponsored by an employer or a close family member to get a "Green Card" (the equivalent of permanent residency for foreign citizens). So, again, it's not easy for retirees unless you have close relatives that are U.S. citizens.
NOTE: As "Permanent Residents" in either Canada or the U.S., you are required to file tax returns if you owe tax or will be due a refund. Both countries have paths to citizenship for permanent residents. Both countries allow for dual citizenship.
ticat900 said
11:07 AM Feb 23, 2016
OP asked ::::Have you run across any movement or groups of health-care 'refugees' setting up domicile in Canada? """"
as said there is no such thing, never has been and never will be
Howard said
12:10 PM Feb 23, 2016
Since this is in the "Ask Howard" forum, I took some liberties and provided information I suspect the original poster, and others curious about the subject, might be looking for.
Clearly there are ways for non-Canadian citizens to take part in Canada's health care system. It's not easy, but it is possible and part of my response was to address the mis-information provided here by our Canadian friends who indicated (no matter how tongue-in-cheek) that it can't be done.
TRAILERKING said
12:44 PM Feb 23, 2016
I don't mean to be a "Misinformant Canadian" but I know If I go down to the U.S., I better have good, current and up to date medical insurance before crossing the border. If something happens and have no insurance we pay big time that can bankrupt a person. I don't know why it would/should be any different for a Non-Canadian needing medical assistance up here? Wouldn't the U.S. citizen require medical insurance also? Kinda like wanting the cake and eat it too.
I'd love to move somewhere warmer in the U.S. forever but we can only be down there for approx. 6 months out of a year then get out.
Howard said
01:13 PM Feb 23, 2016
The original question had to do with setting up domicile (residency) in Canada to access health care coverage because the U.S. coverage may become unaffordable. The question, as I read it, was about "permanently" using Canada's health care as opposed to the United States Affordable Care Act. The question wasn't about being able to just get free Canadian coverage while traveling through Canada, but rather about choosing Canada for primary health coverage.
Perhaps that clears up the confusion.
At any rate, it can be done just as a Canadian, or any other non-U.S. citizen who is approved for a Green Card can set up residency in the U.S. and get U.S. health care coverage under the Affordable Care Act.
The mis-information I was referring to were the comments that it's not possible to get access to Canada's health care without being a Canadian citizen (or foreign refugee). You can access both country's health care by becoming "Permanent Residents" without the need to become legal citizens.
Again, it's very difficult, but if one really can't afford U.S. insurance, one falls under one of the Canadian immigration programs, and one is willing to become at least a "Permanent Resident" (if not a full-blown citizen), then you can "opt" in to Canada's health care. And the same is true for Canadians wanting to "opt" in to the U.S. health care coverage.
But if you aren't willing to jump through the hoops to become a Permanent Resident or simply can't meet the requirements, then "no" you can't access the health care coverage and, while traveling in either country, would need to carry your own from whichever country where you are a citizen.
Again, maybe that clears up the confusion of why I answered the way I did.
melody said
01:34 PM Feb 23, 2016
Howard, thank you very much for setting out the conditions, much appreciated.
As far as the others replying, it's unclear what point you are trying to make, but if it is 'Yankee Go Home' just come out and say so. I'm not trying to freeload your system and I have insurance when I cross your border, I'm asking about changing home base.
I am leaving my place of residence behind completely, and I have to home base and pay taxes somewhere. My original plan was to travel the US, and Canada, indefinitely. One of my goals is to spend time immersed in the trad music in Nova Scotia, for example I am hoping to be able to attend the Colours festival in the fall, and having my own 'home on wheels' would make that possible. As I travel I could look for a small piece of property in Canada if that's part of the process to immigrate.
In the US, my health care deductible for doctors I know is currently $12,600 and my premiums will go to probably $7000 next year, in return for only catastrophic coverage. And I can spend lots more, although it will chew up most of my income and still provide second-rate coverage. It had crossed my mind that moving my home base to Canada might be an option in that I could pay taxes to support a more rational system. I guess I'm supposed to apologize for asking a question? Sheesh.
Again, thanks Howard, that info gives me something to go on.
TRAILERKING said
03:15 PM Feb 23, 2016
melody wrote:
As far as the others replying, it's unclear what point you are trying to make, but if it is 'Yankee Go Home' just come out and say so. I'm not trying to freeload your system and I have insurance when I cross your border, I'm asking about changing home base.
.......It had crossed my mind that moving my home base to Canada might be an option in that I could pay taxes to support a more rational system. I guess I'm supposed to apologize for asking a question? Sheesh.
No, Melody......I did not imply "Yankee Go Home" or you're a "Freeloader". I like that you are wanting to pay into our tax system and get some of the benefits such as cheap health care. However our health system is so abused by our "Born and Raised" Canadians because of that. We need more people willing to move here and pay their way. Not like the boat-loads of immigrants Canada has been bringing in and help with nothing. They get set up with social insurance numbers, places to stay, welfare, food, clothing,.........even now, cell phones. Yet we have homeless people born in this country that don't get supported like the immigrants they bring in.
I welcome you and as many fine U.S. citizens with open arms to come to Canada and invest in our Country. Bring Sir Donald with you too because we need a guy like him up here.
Someday said
06:17 PM Feb 23, 2016
FWIW Melody, when we emigrated to Canada from the UK over two decades ago on the NOC points system as it was then, we had to all, including children undergo a medical, and whilst my husband had no obvious evidence of an umbilical hernia for more than a decade prior and no problems whatsoever with it, because it had been mentioned to his GP (Dr) it was noted on his medical.
Canada insisted he had to have it operated on (even though it was no bigger a protrusion/miniscule tear than a decade plus earlier) All so we didn't become a drain on their health care system at a later date, no matter when that date might or might never be!!! We did what we had to in order for our children's futures which was why we emigrated anyway. Hubby has had ongoing issues ever since the operation = we should have left well alone, but Canada insisted, and we'd both do anything for our children. Just saying FWIW, we jumped through huge hoops, I was interviewed half in english half in french at Canada House in London England, yet as TrailerKing says, our new government is giving a billion dollars for refugee status', yet only $60 per person (quarter of a billion dollars) to the struggling Canadians in the province of Alberta, to say nothing of the money's they are giving Bombardier to stay afloat. For sure there's gotta be some logic there somewhere .... hasn't there????
Believe us, if you are shaking your head at that, it's just a teeny weeny itsy bitsy piece of huge problems coming down the pipelines.
Hi Howard, I know you have great expertise in researching various issues. My concern is, as an early retireee, I have been relying on ACA, which at least provides catastrophic health insurance coverage, if not much else, and the premiums have been manageable. However, as pensions and SS kick in and income rises, the cost will become a very significant portion of my income, again for poor coverage. Not a concern to those past 65, but for those under, it's a big deal.
Have you run across any movement or groups of health-care 'refugees' setting up domicile in Canada?
-- Edited by melody on Monday 22nd of February 2016 07:39:12 PM
simply put there is no such thing. The only way for a non cdn citizen to get free health care in Canada is claim your a Syrian refugee (lol)
I have edited this post because of the confusion . I should have included ""permanent resident"" also can get health care
one of the reasons we have such a drain on our system is many many people have come to Canada over the years under refugee status
and they take a toll on our entire welfare system(tax payers pay)
99% of the born and raised all work and contribute as they should and they are certainly not the problem as others suggest
-- Edited by ticat900 on Tuesday 23rd of February 2016 06:56:12 PM
What about us up here setting up a Domicile in the U.S.??? Is that possible?
NO WAY on both sides... unless you are a refugee !
Melody,
I haven't heard of any groups setting up domicile in Canada, although I did some poking around to see what it might entail.
In order to be eligible for Canada's healthcare program you need to be classified as a "Permanent Resident"; Citizenship is not required.
But "Permanent Resident" status is not easy to obtain if you are a retiree. There are over 60 programs for immigration to Canada, but most of them are for professionals, skilled workers, business owners, or self-employed individuals - those that tend to present the ability to make a positive economic impact (Economic Classes of immigrants). There are also some "Family Class Sponsorships" that are available if you have close relatives in Canada and there are a few other social or humanitarian programs (Non-Economic Classes), but they often require that your "Sponsor" has the economic means to support you.
So that would be the biggest hurdle for you as a retiree. It's much easier for those that move to Canada to work or produce income within the country (there is an "Express Entry" program for certain Economic Classes of immigrants).
Those that are able to gain "Permanent Resident" status just have to be present in Canada for 730 days (two years) out the most recent five years (or be able to show an ability to meet that requirement) to maintain it. HOWEVER, though "Permanent Residents" are generally eligible for Canada's healthcare, you still must meet stricter "presence" requirements to receive services. Each province has its own healthcare plan, and most of them require you to be present IN THE PROVINCE for at least 183 days each year to receive services.
Supporting Links:
Canada Health Act - Frequently Asked Questions
Government of Canada - Understand Permanent Residence Status
CanadaVisa.com - Health Care
TRAILERKING,
The reverse of the above is pretty much true for Canadians coming to the U.S. With a few special exceptions, you must be sponsored by an employer or a close family member to get a "Green Card" (the equivalent of permanent residency for foreign citizens). So, again, it's not easy for retirees unless you have close relatives that are U.S. citizens.
U.S. Citizen & Immigration Services - Green Card
NOTE: As "Permanent Residents" in either Canada or the U.S., you are required to file tax returns if you owe tax or will be due a refund. Both countries have paths to citizenship for permanent residents. Both countries allow for dual citizenship.
as said there is no such thing, never has been and never will be
Since this is in the "Ask Howard" forum, I took some liberties and provided information I suspect the original poster, and others curious about the subject, might be looking for.
Clearly there are ways for non-Canadian citizens to take part in Canada's health care system. It's not easy, but it is possible and part of my response was to address the mis-information provided here by our Canadian friends who indicated (no matter how tongue-in-cheek) that it can't be done.
I'd love to move somewhere warmer in the U.S. forever but we can only be down there for approx. 6 months out of a year then get out.
The original question had to do with setting up domicile (residency) in Canada to access health care coverage because the U.S. coverage may become unaffordable. The question, as I read it, was about "permanently" using Canada's health care as opposed to the United States Affordable Care Act. The question wasn't about being able to just get free Canadian coverage while traveling through Canada, but rather about choosing Canada for primary health coverage.
Perhaps that clears up the confusion.
At any rate, it can be done just as a Canadian, or any other non-U.S. citizen who is approved for a Green Card can set up residency in the U.S. and get U.S. health care coverage under the Affordable Care Act.
The mis-information I was referring to were the comments that it's not possible to get access to Canada's health care without being a Canadian citizen (or foreign refugee). You can access both country's health care by becoming "Permanent Residents" without the need to become legal citizens.
Again, it's very difficult, but if one really can't afford U.S. insurance, one falls under one of the Canadian immigration programs, and one is willing to become at least a "Permanent Resident" (if not a full-blown citizen), then you can "opt" in to Canada's health care. And the same is true for Canadians wanting to "opt" in to the U.S. health care coverage.
But if you aren't willing to jump through the hoops to become a Permanent Resident or simply can't meet the requirements, then "no" you can't access the health care coverage and, while traveling in either country, would need to carry your own from whichever country where you are a citizen.
Again, maybe that clears up the confusion of why I answered the way I did.
As far as the others replying, it's unclear what point you are trying to make, but if it is 'Yankee Go Home' just come out and say so. I'm not trying to freeload your system and I have insurance when I cross your border, I'm asking about changing home base.
I am leaving my place of residence behind completely, and I have to home base and pay taxes somewhere. My original plan was to travel the US, and Canada, indefinitely. One of my goals is to spend time immersed in the trad music in Nova Scotia, for example I am hoping to be able to attend the Colours festival in the fall, and having my own 'home on wheels' would make that possible. As I travel I could look for a small piece of property in Canada if that's part of the process to immigrate.
In the US, my health care deductible for doctors I know is currently $12,600 and my premiums will go to probably $7000 next year, in return for only catastrophic coverage. And I can spend lots more, although it will chew up most of my income and still provide second-rate coverage. It had crossed my mind that moving my home base to Canada might be an option in that I could pay taxes to support a more rational system. I guess I'm supposed to apologize for asking a question? Sheesh.
Again, thanks Howard, that info gives me something to go on.
No, Melody......I did not imply "Yankee Go Home" or you're a "Freeloader". I like that you are wanting to pay into our tax system and get some of the benefits such as cheap health care. However our health system is so abused by our "Born and Raised" Canadians because of that. We need more people willing to move here and pay their way. Not like the boat-loads of immigrants Canada has been bringing in and help with nothing. They get set up with social insurance numbers, places to stay, welfare, food, clothing,.........even now, cell phones. Yet we have homeless people born in this country that don't get supported like the immigrants they bring in.
I welcome you and as many fine U.S. citizens with open arms to come to Canada and invest in our Country. Bring Sir Donald with you too because we need a guy like him up here.
Canada insisted he had to have it operated on (even though it was no bigger a protrusion/miniscule tear than a decade plus earlier) All so we didn't become a drain on their health care system at a later date, no matter when that date might or might never be!!! We did what we had to in order for our children's futures which was why we emigrated anyway. Hubby has had ongoing issues ever since the operation = we should have left well alone, but Canada insisted, and we'd both do anything for our children. Just saying FWIW, we jumped through huge hoops, I was interviewed half in english half in french at Canada House in London England, yet as TrailerKing says, our new government is giving a billion dollars for refugee status', yet only $60 per person (quarter of a billion dollars) to the struggling Canadians in the province of Alberta, to say nothing of the money's they are giving Bombardier to stay afloat. For sure there's gotta be some logic there somewhere .... hasn't there????
Believe us, if you are shaking your head at that, it's just a teeny weeny itsy bitsy piece of huge problems coming down the pipelines.