I'm planning to make the decision in the coming months. I've been stuck on the combo of new travel trailer and used pickup, but I want to revisit the idea of a Class A because it would have some advantages. The disadvantage is that I'd have to buy used, my top budget would be about $25K and a $5K repair budget, or similar. That might get me what I want, but there are so many expensive things that can go wrong on a used Class A that a new trailer doesn't face.
Searches suggest that I'd be starting with something that's about 10 years old. Could I get 5 years use without it becoming a money pit? And shopping is a whole other can of worms, just the thought of hidden water damage sends chills down my spine. I have visions of fiberglass that's intact after 10 years suddenly delaminating a month after I buy it. Leveling jacks sound wonderful until they malfunction. A new trailer and used pickup is a less risky combo, it seems, and a trailer would give more space for the price.
But it would be nice to have a smaller car when camped, a Class A sounds easier to set up solo, a little easier to drive, more fun for the occasional passengers, etc. So if I can do it safely within my budget constraints, I should consider it. I can allocate more for repairs and less for purchase, but $30K total is about my limit for a class A. The car, hitch, etc would be on another budget.
So... all feedback appreciated, especially if anybody has experience shopping in that price range.
BiggarView said
12:06 PM Oct 1, 2015
Talk you into a class A....
okay, step one find a class A.
Step two, open the door and climb in.
You have just been talked into a class A. Whether that was helpful for you in your decision, probably not. I now turn you over to more serious thought on the subject. (levity is my specialty)
FWIW, Brian
-- Edited by biggaRView on Thursday 1st of October 2015 12:06:31 PM
The Bear II said
01:30 PM Oct 1, 2015
We have been talking about replacing our 21 year old 5th wheel with a new RV. Choice is between a new 5th wheel or a Class A.
Each time we look at a Class A the price throws us back towards a 5th wheel since we already have a great truck to tow with.
If we had to buy a truck and a 5th wheel or TT - The Class A would probably be a better choice because the cost would be closer.
The main argument has always been If the engine, trans or drive train on a Class A fails you're stuck without a home (usually) while it's being repaired.
With a truck and trailer the truck will go in the shop and you still have the trailer to stay in.
Another argument was that Class A's took less time to setup camp or tear down camp. That's no longer true now that TT and 5th wheels can be equipped with the same auto gadgets as MHs. Levelers, awnings, antennas, power cord re-tractors...etc
Keep in mind some RV Parks restrict age of RV to 10 years or newer. Most parks allow leeway if your RV is well kept but some are very strict.
We enjoy being able to use our truck to sight see or run errands once the 5th wheel is set in place at an RV Park. With a Class A it would be either break camp or tow a vehicle for sight seeing.
-- Edited by The Bear II on Thursday 1st of October 2015 01:31:37 PM
Hdrider said
01:50 PM Oct 1, 2015
Can't talk you into it and wouldn't want to. But for us we like driving the motorhome much more than a pickup pulling a 5th wheel (we have done both). We love the big windshield, we love being up above the traffic, we love pulling the Jeep having it as our daily driver rather than a large truck, we like the extra weight that comes with a Class A while in winds either on the road OR sitting, we love that our particular rig is homey like a lot of the 5th wheels are, our first class A not so much, I love the storage we have in the belly (I know this can be argued by 5th wheel owners but I feel we have more storage underneath that is easier to get to), I think we worry less about weight than most 5th wheel owners but that will vary from rig to rig.
We have talked about when the time comes that we slow down our travels that a nice 5th wheel might be in the future at that time but not certain, certainly not against it.
Sure, if our Class A has running gear issues we will be spending time in a repair shops lot or a hotel but there are a number of things that could go wrong with a 5th wheel that would create the same issue's. Or the tow rig could have issues leaving you stuck in one spot as well.
I also like the ability to stop, unhook our Jeep to scout out an area if needed without having to hook back up to move our home (if traveling in pairs). I don't think I would ever unhook a 5th wheel at the entrance of a park so I could drive my truck to scout.
It's really a toss up in my mind and depends on how you want to travel.
Good luck
BiggarView said
02:08 PM Oct 1, 2015
Okay had my fun. Seriously... I have been researching costs of a class A DP vs a truck and fifth wheel. We lean toward the 5er option more on lifestyle than costs. I found that operating costs seem to be higher for a class A when you factor in mechanical maintenance, tires, fuel, oil changes etc. My gut says that items in the rig would longer lasting in a class A vs a 5er owing to heavier chassis and probably smoother ride. Therefore the nod for lower general rig maintenance goes to a class A. It is hard to calculate an expense budget for infrequent item replacement so anecdotal evidence is very valuable. Class A's will probably cost more to insure for a given size. If you get a class A you'll probably need a toad... more maintenance and insurance but better fuel economy for running about and lower maintenance cost for a given type of repair or service than a large PU truck. The thing that holds us up on a class A is storage for our hobbies and crafts. We haven't sorted out our needs in this area but Cindi really wants me to take my model trains with me and I've had real heatburn about it. (in case you want to suggest a toyhauler... we haven't found a floorplan that we can live with) They (my trains and her crafts) take up so much space and what I envision as a bare minimum would take up all the cargo bays due to the bulkiness of 4 connectable "modules" that could allow me to set up a modest (my standard) layout..... But I digress.
As you can see, we need space but costs are important. For those reasons a 5er better suits our needs, but a couple of class A's are still in the running. Whether you choose a class A or a 5er or TT should be based mostly on your lifestyle goals. We don't plan on moving about frequently and a Class A is reported to be better in that environment... seems logical. Not moving a lot lends itself to 5ers as they feel more homey and spacious... at least to us.
Your mileage may vary as they say.
JMHO, Brian
-- Edited by biggaRView on Thursday 1st of October 2015 02:11:49 PM
Bill and Jodee said
07:45 PM Oct 1, 2015
Seeing the country through an IMAX window is one reason we love this life. There's just no comparison to a pick-up window. We also wanted our day trip vehicle to be trail rated and smaller than a big truck. Our 35' DP has more room than two of us and a dog really need to be comfortable so the 5er doesn't offer us anything we need. There are more 5ers parked for long term in the parks we stay in so I'm sure most who don't move much prefer the separation of living areas.
Good luck and have fun!
Jodee
bjoyce said
08:13 PM Oct 1, 2015
I am no help, because I think these things are a personal decision. We have a Class A, it works for us. We have friends in 5th wheels, it works for them. We have friends in TTs, Class Cs and truck campers, which all work for them. I have made multiple attempts to create an "RV choice" video for my YouTube channel and haven't published any of them. I keep feeling like the subject is a rabbit hole.
bobk3d said
07:45 AM Oct 2, 2015
Thanks all. I wanted to get some feedback in case it's a more viable option than I thought. The thread title was a teaser. :)
The one constant factor seems to be that Class A's are more costly to maintain, and that's a major decision factor for me. And it sounds like trying to do a Class A on the cheap is an invitation to trouble, unless you really know how to buy well. And then there's that 10-year age factor at some parks. That's what scares me about shopping for any used RV, they might be okay now but what will they be like after five more years?
My prediction is that I'll travel a lot for the first year or two, then slow down and do more monthly or seasonal stays. So nothing is perfect for me, but I don't want to switch vehicles just to change styles. Still leaning to the trailer, but I appreciate the added perspectives.
Terry and Jo said
09:54 AM Oct 2, 2015
Bob,
Lifestyle ideas will help with choosing. If one is moving frequently, then a Class A might be best. If one is staying put for extended periods (longer than a month or two), then I'd suggest a trailer. In our own case, when we began full-time living in our RV, we were still working and knew that on occasion, we would both have to be going different directions on the same day. (Fortunately, that was rare because we both worked at the same place.) Thus, we needed two vehicles. With the fifth wheel, if Jo needed the daily driver, I took the F450.
In addition to that, our plans were to go to an area of the country and perhaps stay for anywhere from 1 to 6 months or more while we used the second vehicle to explore all the attractions we wanted to see in that area. Once we were content with what we might see, we'd then move to another area and begin that process again. We are now retired, but still are staying put for an extended time with plans for another two years in the Colorado Springs area to be near one of Jo's sister's home. So, if we go that long, we will be here for a total of 3 years. The daily driver also lets us take a number of family members or friends on excursions with everyone being comfortable.
If you go the trailer method, look at the outside storage capability of the trailer. A fifth wheel might have more storage for you, especially since you will be in the rig for some time. As for ease of access to stuff in a fifth wheel over a Class A, we store most of our stuff in clear plastic bins that we bought from Target. If needed, I could probably empty the basement in about 5 minutes if it were absolutely necessary. Our previous RV was a 26-foot fifth wheel with a shallow area under the basement, so I had two long clear bins, with each one accessible through the opposite doors of the basement area. However, we weren't living in that fifth wheel, so there wasn't really much to store in it.
Also with respect to trailers, a fifth wheel will pull a lot easier and be more stable than a travel trailer. Just be sure that you choose the trailer first so you can take the weight of that trailer fully loaded and be sure you get a truck that will handle that weight safely.
Good luck.
Terry
Selah said
10:55 AM Oct 2, 2015
A TT, 5th wheel, or class A; it is a personnel choice that only you can make. There is really nothing wrong with any of them. However based on your stated budget I would think a TT would be first choice, followed by a 5th wheel. A $25K class A is going to have problems, lots of problems that would blow your budget very quickly.
IMHO
bobk3d said
11:13 AM Oct 2, 2015
Thanks, Terry. I'm basically looking at trailer and truck as a combo... for a certain trailer, how big a truck do I need to tow safely. Lifestyle-wise, I'd probably prefer the class A at first, but longer-term I envision moving around less.
(I started out with... - wow, I could tow that with my Forester, but it's marginal. - well what can I safely tow with 3500# rated SUV? - well what can I safely tow with a 5000# rated SUV? - well what can I safely tow with a 7000# rated SUV? - Okay, I need a real truck with longer wheelbase)
But once I resigned to driving a pickup, and realized how much heavy stuff I could store in the bed (generator, tools, etc), it seems a lot easier, not to mention a few $K cheaper. I've been aiming for a dry trailer weight about 5000 lbs; I should be able to find a "1500" (are those "half-ton"?) that can handle it with a good safety margin. So I'd like to stay at that size truck, since it'll have to double as my car. The challenge with 5th wheels is that the overall weight tends to be higher than a trailer for the amount of space, at least in my price range, so I'm not seeing much that I really like, unless I go another rung up the size/price ladder. If I could, I'd go for a private rail car, but I seem to be $1 million short.
biggaRView wrote:
... Cindi really wants me to take my model trains with me and I've had real heatburn about it. (in case you want to suggest a toyhauler... we haven't found a floorplan that we can live with) They (my trains and her crafts) take up so much space and what I envision as a bare minimum would take up all the cargo bays due to the bulkiness of 4 connectable "modules" that could allow me to set up a modest (my standard) layout..... But I digress.
Now that's ambitious. If our paths ever cross, be sure to show me your trains, and I'll show you some 3D slides from years past, both models and full-size. Here's a layout I shot in the 80's, there's a "2D" button you can click to view it normal. This stuff is easy nowadays with digital, back then we had to modify lenses to get enough depth of field.
http://phereo.com/image/52f50261cb8577af6c000035
I looked at toy haulers, too, but they're all designed for a certain target market. And they're heavy.
bobk3d said
11:24 AM Oct 2, 2015
Selah wrote:
A $25K class A is going to have problems, lots of problems that would blow your budget very quickly. IMHO
Yes, that's what I'm afraid of. But I wanted to ask around since it does have some appeal.
A huge shout-out to everybody here & elsewhere who has posted their experiences to the web & YouTube. I'm still amazed at how much I was able to learn before I had to start asking specific questions.
BiggarView said
12:21 PM Oct 2, 2015
bobk3d wrote:
...biggaRView wrote:
... Cindi really wants me to take my model trains with me and I've had real heatburn about it. (in case you want to suggest a toyhauler... we haven't found a floorplan that we can live with) They (my trains and her crafts) take up so much space and what I envision as a bare minimum would take up all the cargo bays due to the bulkiness of 4 connectable "modules" that could allow me to set up a modest (my standard) layout..... But I digress.
Now that's ambitious. If our paths ever cross, be sure to show me your trains, and I'll show you some 3D slides from years past, both models and full-size. Here's a layout I shot in the 80's, there's a "2D" button you can click to view it normal. This stuff is easy nowadays with digital, back then we had to modify lenses to get enough depth of field.
http://phereo.com/image/52f50261cb8577af6c000035
I looked at toy haulers, too, but they're all designed for a certain target market. And they're heavy.
Yeah it is, I've considered downsizing to "N' scale but my eyes and fingers ain't 20 anymore. Stlll the Lifestyle Luxury and Alfa Gold lines have this 9x4x7.5 "side hauler option" that might suit our needs. I'd need about half that space for the modules and assorted gear and rolling stock. Cindi could have a desk to work on. So it's possible, but the possibility is also hamstringing my plan to sell off at least 90% of my existing stuff... separation anxiety. If it comes with me, I'll surely be setting up in every CG we land at. It's a great hobby. Now if we ever cross paths with Red (el Rojo and Pam) I may get hooked on RC.
Barbaraok said
01:10 PM Oct 2, 2015
bobk3d wrote:
Thanks, Terry. I'm basically looking at trailer and truck as a combo... for a certain trailer, how big a truck do I need to tow safely. Lifestyle-wise, I'd probably prefer the class A at first, but longer-term I envision moving around less.
(I started out with... - wow, I could tow that with my Forester, but it's marginal. - well what can I safely tow with 3500# rated SUV? - well what can I safely tow with a 5000# rated SUV? - well what can I safely tow with a 7000# rated SUV? - Okay, I need a real truck with longer wheelbase)
But once I resigned to driving a pickup, and realized how much heavy stuff I could store in the bed (generator, tools, etc), it seems a lot easier, not to mention a few $K cheaper. I've been aiming for a dry trailer weight about 5000 lbs; I should be able to find a "1500" (are those "half-ton"?) that can handle it with a good safety margin. So I'd like to stay at that size truck, since it'll have to double as my car. The challenge with 5th wheels is that the overall weight tends to be higher than a trailer for the amount of space, at least in my price range, so I'm not seeing much that I really like, unless I go another rung up the size/price ladder. If I could, I'd go for a private rail car, but I seem to be $1 million short…….
If you want to stay at a ½ T truck, then you really are looking at a very light weight trailer. Which is ok as long as you understand you will need to follow the sun because they don't have very good insulation, and that you will be limited as to what you can take with you. What is it that you like to do? Hobbies? $25K for a Class A will limit you to those that will need work. Get the truck you can afford and then match the trailer - you really need to make sure that your truck can STOP that trailer coming down a mountain pass. It isn't about what they can pull, but rather what they can stop.
Barb
bobk3d said
12:23 AM Oct 3, 2015
Barbaraok wrote:
If you want to stay at a ½ T truck, then you really are looking at a very light weight trailer. Which is ok as long as you understand you will need to follow the sun because they don't have very good insulation, and that you will be limited as to what you can take with you. What is it that you like to do? Hobbies? $25K for a Class A will limit you to those that will need work. Get the truck you can afford and then match the trailer - you really need to make sure that your truck can STOP that trailer coming down a mountain pass. It isn't about what they can pull, but rather what they can stop.
Barb
It definitely limits me, but there are some spacious lightweight options, and a few with better insulation. Not a wide choice, but they exist.
I asked this question in case people said that a buying used Class A was less risky than it looks. But overall it sounds like I should stay with the trailer idea.
Terry and Jo said
09:27 AM Oct 3, 2015
Bob,
Even with the travel trailers, watch the weights. We used to have a 26-foot Salem TT. I chose it because I wanted to be able to tow it with either the Ford Excursion we had at the time, of the F150. Our RV dealer soon informed me that the Salem would be too heavy for an F150, so we had to also trade up to an F250 (3/4 ton) pickup.
When we traded that for the 26-foot fifth wheel, it was a Rockwood Ultralite that the dealer said that an F150 could have pulled. Being an old truck driver and driving professionally, I was still glad we had the F250. Even with it, that gasoline engine really seemed to work hard to pull the fifth wheel. Now, with a diesel F450, it doesn't even seem to know it's pulling an 18,500 lb trailer.
Terry
bobk3d said
07:15 PM Oct 4, 2015
Thanks... I know a lot of people cut corners on the tow vehicle, and apparently dealers are the most optimistic of all. I like to think I'll be more cautious than most, especially when it comes to safety. But I tend to study all the capacities and leave some safety margin, rather than thinking in broad terms like half-ton or 3/4. Those seem useful for telling you about the body style, but there seems to be a lot of variation in capacities among them.
Honestly, I never paid attention to pickups, so now I'm noticing them as I drive around and getting a better idea of what each is like. I may be able to spend more than I expected, so when I get all squared away, then I'll shop for both. Right now I'm choosing among hypothetical compromises, and I change my mind daily. Small, large, construction type, insulation, weight, slideouts, floorplan, length, and 5th wheels are still an outside possibility. And then I'll need to fit a workspace into whatever it is, and I'll probably want to upgrade the electrics. Arrrghhhh! But I'm accumulating a lot of information, and it will be useful.
bjoyce said
08:54 PM Oct 4, 2015
Another compromise is a truck camper. There are some good ones out there and many are made with good insulation, since they are popular with hunters
Jcently said
02:25 PM Oct 10, 2015
I am currently sitting at an RV dealer and had the same dilemma. I have finally decided to go with the Fifth Wheel for two reasons: the price and comfort, the class A is at least $40K more and has a lot less storage space compared to the Fifth Wheel. It has taken me months and months to make a decision but today I had enough and I I am going for it. Working the numbers now.
kb0zke said
06:13 PM Oct 23, 2015
Bob, you've gotten a lot of good advice here. I'd suggest that you start with your "mission plan" rather than your budget. How will you use your coach? Are you looking at moving 50-100 miles at a time at least monthly, or will you be parked for several months at a time? How many people and pets? How agile is everyone? How much "stuff" will you be taking with you?
When we started our research for a full-time coach we didn't know whether a TT, a 5'er, or a MH would be best. All we knew was that we wanted a high quality coach. At first we thought it would be a 5'er, but as we researched and considered how WE would be living, it because obvious that a MH fit us better. Our question was DP or gasser. We quickly found out that a DP was the better choice FOR US.
As for vehicles, get used to the idea that you will have one vehicle towing another. A MH can tow a car or truck, while a 5'er or TT will need to be towed by a truck, and the larger the coach the bigger the truck. Check www.remcoindustries.com/Towing/Store.php to see if your current vehicle could be towed.
There are some nice upper-end MH's for sale for your price, but you will have to look. I just saw a 76 Newell that has had extensive upgrading done for $25,000. I suspect that you could get a Foretravel similar to ours for that price.
If you have more questions please PM me. I'll be glad to go over our thinking and send you some links.
bobk3d said
02:17 PM Oct 24, 2015
Thanks. It's nice to get feedback from somebody besides uninitiated friends, whose comments seem limited to "Great idea!" and, "You're crazy!".
"Mission plan" is good advice, especially since mine might change after a couple of years. I want to spend a couple of years doing extended travel in the west and short stays, but I expect I'll eventually grow tired of driving that much, and eventually settle into a pattern of summers in the northeast and winters in Florida, mostly stays of a month or longer. I'm healthy and agile enough to handle trailer setup, old enough to dislike it, and not getting any younger.
I really like the idea of towing a smaller car as a daily driver. A Subaru Impreza stick shift is towable and 3000#, and I'd have some change after trading my Forester. My estimate, even if I travel x-country, is a maximum 12K miles towing, but constant 15K unhitched, so the unhitched gas mileage matters. It's not a huge difference on an annual basis, but I'll take more day trips and enjoy them more if I'm getting 25mpg instead of 15mpg, especially in the expensive states.
I'm wondering if the best approach would be to find a Class C that I'll be able to sell at minimal loss after 2 years & 25K miles, do some extensive travel, and then consider swapping into a towable. That's probably the smart approach, I could choose a towable for living instead of travel. Longer-term, I'm wondering if I can eventually live in a trailer without owning a truck, just do seasonal leases and have it hauled between New England and Florida in spring and fall.
It seems like it's much easier to evaluate and service second-hand C's than A's. It looks like there's a truck and there's a camper and not much integration. My impression is that most C's can tow 5000#, and I'd have something much lighter. One concern is that the bigger C's tend to have a long rear overhang, which can't help the towing ability.
A lot will depend on my final budget, which I can't make a decision about yet. It also depends on what's available when I go shopping.
kb0zke said
02:50 PM Oct 24, 2015
Bob, our son is a big Subaru fan and has tried to talk us into a Sub towed. When I stopped at his dealer recently, though, I found out that none of the current crop of Subarus are towable. It seems that they are changing transmissions. Check www.remcoindustries.com/Towing/Store.php before you write a check. <grin>
I'm not a fan of a C. Check the weights on some, and you may find that they are nearly at gross weight before you put anything in them. Before anyone jumps me on that, not all of them are that bad, but some have had such problems. BUYER BEWARE! Also check the combined weight ratings. Coaches that appear to be similar on the surface may have big differences underneath. For example, our coach has a GW of 30,000 pounds and GCWR of 36,000 pounds. In other words, I can tow 6000 pounds even with the coach at full gross weight. The next coach down the line has a gross weight of 28,000 pounds and a GCWR of 30,000 pounds. In other words, that coach can tow only 2000 pounds while at gross weight.
To get an idea of what sort of depreciation you might be looking at, try to find a coach that is two years older than the one you are looking at. Check www.pplmotorhomes.com/ for this. Scroll down a bit to Used RVs and Motor Homes by Brands and Models-Preowned Motorhomes & RVS for this part.
Keep up the research. I should probably make this sentence part of my signature, since I use it so often. I'd rather ask a thousand questions before writing a very large check than ask the same question a thousand times afterward.
bjoyce said
08:51 PM Oct 24, 2015
Subaru said in 2013 and I have found no newer info - "AWD Subaru vehicles with manual transmission can be towed with all four wheels on the ground and the transmission in neutral. When towing a manual transmission Subaru behind your motor home, you would want the transmission in neutral and the key in the 'ACC' position. As all new models are equipped with digital odometers, mileage will not accumulate when being towed."
Notice that "manual transmission", which is the same as "stick shift". Subaru automatics have never been flat towable.
Barbaraok said
09:11 PM Oct 24, 2015
We have towed a MANUAL transmission Subaru for 10 years - over 100K miles towed, not to mention another 100K miles on the odometer. Automatic transmission Subarus can't be towed 4-down.
Barb
bobk3d said
11:13 PM Oct 24, 2015
Right, I meant a manual transmission, otherwise I could tow my current Forester. It's nice that there are no modifications required to tow with a manual trans.
Or perhaps I could tow a Forester, and beef it up light off-roading. Hmmmm.
-- Edited by bobk3d on Saturday 24th of October 2015 11:13:38 PM
I'm planning to make the decision in the coming months. I've been stuck on the combo of new travel trailer and used pickup, but I want to revisit the idea of a Class A because it would have some advantages. The disadvantage is that I'd have to buy used, my top budget would be about $25K and a $5K repair budget, or similar. That might get me what I want, but there are so many expensive things that can go wrong on a used Class A that a new trailer doesn't face.
Searches suggest that I'd be starting with something that's about 10 years old. Could I get 5 years use without it becoming a money pit? And shopping is a whole other can of worms, just the thought of hidden water damage sends chills down my spine. I have visions of fiberglass that's intact after 10 years suddenly delaminating a month after I buy it. Leveling jacks sound wonderful until they malfunction. A new trailer and used pickup is a less risky combo, it seems, and a trailer would give more space for the price.
But it would be nice to have a smaller car when camped, a Class A sounds easier to set up solo, a little easier to drive, more fun for the occasional passengers, etc. So if I can do it safely within my budget constraints, I should consider it. I can allocate more for repairs and less for purchase, but $30K total is about my limit for a class A. The car, hitch, etc would be on another budget.
So... all feedback appreciated, especially if anybody has experience shopping in that price range.
Talk you into a class A....
okay, step one find a class A.
Step two, open the door and climb in.
You have just been talked into a class A. Whether that was helpful for you in your decision, probably not. I now turn you over to more serious thought on the subject. (levity is my specialty)
FWIW, Brian
-- Edited by biggaRView on Thursday 1st of October 2015 12:06:31 PM
We have been talking about replacing our 21 year old 5th wheel with a new RV. Choice is between a new 5th wheel or a Class A.
Each time we look at a Class A the price throws us back towards a 5th wheel since we already have a great truck to tow with.
If we had to buy a truck and a 5th wheel or TT - The Class A would probably be a better choice because the cost would be closer.
The main argument has always been If the engine, trans or drive train on a Class A fails you're stuck without a home (usually) while it's being repaired.
With a truck and trailer the truck will go in the shop and you still have the trailer to stay in.
Another argument was that Class A's took less time to setup camp or tear down camp. That's no longer true now that TT and 5th wheels can be equipped with the same auto gadgets as MHs. Levelers, awnings, antennas, power cord re-tractors...etc
Keep in mind some RV Parks restrict age of RV to 10 years or newer. Most parks allow leeway if your RV is well kept but some are very strict.
We enjoy being able to use our truck to sight see or run errands once the 5th wheel is set in place at an RV Park. With a Class A it would be either break camp or tow a vehicle for sight seeing.
-- Edited by The Bear II on Thursday 1st of October 2015 01:31:37 PM
We have talked about when the time comes that we slow down our travels that a nice 5th wheel might be in the future at that time but not certain, certainly not against it.
Sure, if our Class A has running gear issues we will be spending time in a repair shops lot or a hotel but there are a number of things that could go wrong with a 5th wheel that would create the same issue's. Or the tow rig could have issues leaving you stuck in one spot as well.
I also like the ability to stop, unhook our Jeep to scout out an area if needed without having to hook back up to move our home (if traveling in pairs). I don't think I would ever unhook a 5th wheel at the entrance of a park so I could drive my truck to scout.
It's really a toss up in my mind and depends on how you want to travel.
Good luck
Okay had my fun. Seriously... I have been researching costs of a class A DP vs a truck and fifth wheel. We lean toward the 5er option more on lifestyle than costs. I found that operating costs seem to be higher for a class A when you factor in mechanical maintenance, tires, fuel, oil changes etc. My gut says that items in the rig would longer lasting in a class A vs a 5er owing to heavier chassis and probably smoother ride. Therefore the nod for lower general rig maintenance goes to a class A. It is hard to calculate an expense budget for infrequent item replacement so anecdotal evidence is very valuable. Class A's will probably cost more to insure for a given size. If you get a class A you'll probably need a toad... more maintenance and insurance but better fuel economy for running about and lower maintenance cost for a given type of repair or service than a large PU truck. The thing that holds us up on a class A is storage for our hobbies and crafts. We haven't sorted out our needs in this area but Cindi really wants me to take my model trains with me and I've had real heatburn about it. (in case you want to suggest a toyhauler... we haven't found a floorplan that we can live with) They (my trains and her crafts) take up so much space and what I envision as a bare minimum would take up all the cargo bays due to the bulkiness of 4 connectable "modules" that could allow me to set up a modest (my standard) layout..... But I digress.
As you can see, we need space but costs are important. For those reasons a 5er better suits our needs, but a couple of class A's are still in the running. Whether you choose a class A or a 5er or TT should be based mostly on your lifestyle goals. We don't plan on moving about frequently and a Class A is reported to be better in that environment... seems logical. Not moving a lot lends itself to 5ers as they feel more homey and spacious... at least to us.
Your mileage may vary as they say.
JMHO, Brian
-- Edited by biggaRView on Thursday 1st of October 2015 02:11:49 PM
Good luck and have fun!
Jodee
The one constant factor seems to be that Class A's are more costly to maintain, and that's a major decision factor for me. And it sounds like trying to do a Class A on the cheap is an invitation to trouble, unless you really know how to buy well. And then there's that 10-year age factor at some parks. That's what scares me about shopping for any used RV, they might be okay now but what will they be like after five more years?
My prediction is that I'll travel a lot for the first year or two, then slow down and do more monthly or seasonal stays. So nothing is perfect for me, but I don't want to switch vehicles just to change styles. Still leaning to the trailer, but I appreciate the added perspectives.
Bob,
Lifestyle ideas will help with choosing. If one is moving frequently, then a Class A might be best. If one is staying put for extended periods (longer than a month or two), then I'd suggest a trailer. In our own case, when we began full-time living in our RV, we were still working and knew that on occasion, we would both have to be going different directions on the same day. (Fortunately, that was rare because we both worked at the same place.) Thus, we needed two vehicles. With the fifth wheel, if Jo needed the daily driver, I took the F450.
In addition to that, our plans were to go to an area of the country and perhaps stay for anywhere from 1 to 6 months or more while we used the second vehicle to explore all the attractions we wanted to see in that area. Once we were content with what we might see, we'd then move to another area and begin that process again. We are now retired, but still are staying put for an extended time with plans for another two years in the Colorado Springs area to be near one of Jo's sister's home. So, if we go that long, we will be here for a total of 3 years. The daily driver also lets us take a number of family members or friends on excursions with everyone being comfortable.
If you go the trailer method, look at the outside storage capability of the trailer. A fifth wheel might have more storage for you, especially since you will be in the rig for some time. As for ease of access to stuff in a fifth wheel over a Class A, we store most of our stuff in clear plastic bins that we bought from Target. If needed, I could probably empty the basement in about 5 minutes if it were absolutely necessary. Our previous RV was a 26-foot fifth wheel with a shallow area under the basement, so I had two long clear bins, with each one accessible through the opposite doors of the basement area. However, we weren't living in that fifth wheel, so there wasn't really much to store in it.
Also with respect to trailers, a fifth wheel will pull a lot easier and be more stable than a travel trailer. Just be sure that you choose the trailer first so you can take the weight of that trailer fully loaded and be sure you get a truck that will handle that weight safely.
Good luck.
Terry
IMHO
Thanks, Terry. I'm basically looking at trailer and truck as a combo... for a certain trailer, how big a truck do I need to tow safely. Lifestyle-wise, I'd probably prefer the class A at first, but longer-term I envision moving around less.
(I started out with...
- wow, I could tow that with my Forester, but it's marginal.
- well what can I safely tow with 3500# rated SUV?
- well what can I safely tow with a 5000# rated SUV?
- well what can I safely tow with a 7000# rated SUV?
- Okay, I need a real truck with longer wheelbase)
But once I resigned to driving a pickup, and realized how much heavy stuff I could store in the bed (generator, tools, etc), it seems a lot easier, not to mention a few $K cheaper. I've been aiming for a dry trailer weight about 5000 lbs; I should be able to find a "1500" (are those "half-ton"?) that can handle it with a good safety margin. So I'd like to stay at that size truck, since it'll have to double as my car. The challenge with 5th wheels is that the overall weight tends to be higher than a trailer for the amount of space, at least in my price range, so I'm not seeing much that I really like, unless I go another rung up the size/price ladder. If I could, I'd go for a private rail car, but I seem to be $1 million short.
biggaRView wrote:
... Cindi really wants me to take my model trains with me and I've had real heatburn about it. (in case you want to suggest a toyhauler... we haven't found a floorplan that we can live with) They (my trains and her crafts) take up so much space and what I envision as a bare minimum would take up all the cargo bays due to the bulkiness of 4 connectable "modules" that could allow me to set up a modest (my standard) layout..... But I digress.
Now that's ambitious. If our paths ever cross, be sure to show me your trains, and I'll show you some 3D slides from years past, both models and full-size. Here's a layout I shot in the 80's, there's a "2D" button you can click to view it normal. This stuff is easy nowadays with digital, back then we had to modify lenses to get enough depth of field.
http://phereo.com/image/52f50261cb8577af6c000035
I looked at toy haulers, too, but they're all designed for a certain target market. And they're heavy.
Yes, that's what I'm afraid of. But I wanted to ask around since it does have some appeal.
A huge shout-out to everybody here & elsewhere who has posted their experiences to the web & YouTube. I'm still amazed at how much I was able to learn before I had to start asking specific questions.
Yeah it is, I've considered downsizing to "N' scale but my eyes and fingers ain't 20 anymore.
Stlll the Lifestyle Luxury and Alfa Gold lines have this 9x4x7.5 "side hauler option" that might suit our needs. I'd need about half that space for the modules and assorted gear and rolling stock. Cindi could have a desk to work on. So it's possible, but the possibility is also hamstringing my plan to sell off at least 90% of my existing stuff... separation anxiety.
If it comes with me, I'll surely be setting up in every CG we land at. It's a great hobby. Now if we ever cross paths with Red (el Rojo and Pam) I may get hooked on RC.
It definitely limits me, but there are some spacious lightweight options, and a few with better insulation. Not a wide choice, but they exist.
I asked this question in case people said that a buying used Class A was less risky than it looks. But overall it sounds like I should stay with the trailer idea.
Bob,
Even with the travel trailers, watch the weights. We used to have a 26-foot Salem TT. I chose it because I wanted to be able to tow it with either the Ford Excursion we had at the time, of the F150. Our RV dealer soon informed me that the Salem would be too heavy for an F150, so we had to also trade up to an F250 (3/4 ton) pickup.
When we traded that for the 26-foot fifth wheel, it was a Rockwood Ultralite that the dealer said that an F150 could have pulled. Being an old truck driver and driving professionally, I was still glad we had the F250. Even with it, that gasoline engine really seemed to work hard to pull the fifth wheel. Now, with a diesel F450, it doesn't even seem to know it's pulling an 18,500 lb trailer.
Terry
Honestly, I never paid attention to pickups, so now I'm noticing them as I drive around and getting a better idea of what each is like. I may be able to spend more than I expected, so when I get all squared away, then I'll shop for both. Right now I'm choosing among hypothetical compromises, and I change my mind daily. Small, large, construction type, insulation, weight, slideouts, floorplan, length, and 5th wheels are still an outside possibility. And then I'll need to fit a workspace into whatever it is, and I'll probably want to upgrade the electrics. Arrrghhhh! But I'm accumulating a lot of information, and it will be useful.
When we started our research for a full-time coach we didn't know whether a TT, a 5'er, or a MH would be best. All we knew was that we wanted a high quality coach. At first we thought it would be a 5'er, but as we researched and considered how WE would be living, it because obvious that a MH fit us better. Our question was DP or gasser. We quickly found out that a DP was the better choice FOR US.
As for vehicles, get used to the idea that you will have one vehicle towing another. A MH can tow a car or truck, while a 5'er or TT will need to be towed by a truck, and the larger the coach the bigger the truck. Check www.remcoindustries.com/Towing/Store.php to see if your current vehicle could be towed.
There are some nice upper-end MH's for sale for your price, but you will have to look. I just saw a 76 Newell that has had extensive upgrading done for $25,000. I suspect that you could get a Foretravel similar to ours for that price.
If you have more questions please PM me. I'll be glad to go over our thinking and send you some links.
Thanks. It's nice to get feedback from somebody besides uninitiated friends, whose comments seem limited to "Great idea!" and, "You're crazy!".
"Mission plan" is good advice, especially since mine might change after a couple of years. I want to spend a couple of years doing extended travel in the west and short stays, but I expect I'll eventually grow tired of driving that much, and eventually settle into a pattern of summers in the northeast and winters in Florida, mostly stays of a month or longer. I'm healthy and agile enough to handle trailer setup, old enough to dislike it, and not getting any younger.
I really like the idea of towing a smaller car as a daily driver. A Subaru Impreza stick shift is towable and 3000#, and I'd have some change after trading my Forester. My estimate, even if I travel x-country, is a maximum 12K miles towing, but constant 15K unhitched, so the unhitched gas mileage matters. It's not a huge difference on an annual basis, but I'll take more day trips and enjoy them more if I'm getting 25mpg instead of 15mpg, especially in the expensive states.
I'm wondering if the best approach would be to find a Class C that I'll be able to sell at minimal loss after 2 years & 25K miles, do some extensive travel, and then consider swapping into a towable. That's probably the smart approach, I could choose a towable for living instead of travel. Longer-term, I'm wondering if I can eventually live in a trailer without owning a truck, just do seasonal leases and have it hauled between New England and Florida in spring and fall.
It seems like it's much easier to evaluate and service second-hand C's than A's. It looks like there's a truck and there's a camper and not much integration. My impression is that most C's can tow 5000#, and I'd have something much lighter. One concern is that the bigger C's tend to have a long rear overhang, which can't help the towing ability.
A lot will depend on my final budget, which I can't make a decision about yet. It also depends on what's available when I go shopping.
I'm not a fan of a C. Check the weights on some, and you may find that they are nearly at gross weight before you put anything in them. Before anyone jumps me on that, not all of them are that bad, but some have had such problems. BUYER BEWARE! Also check the combined weight ratings. Coaches that appear to be similar on the surface may have big differences underneath. For example, our coach has a GW of 30,000 pounds and GCWR of 36,000 pounds. In other words, I can tow 6000 pounds even with the coach at full gross weight. The next coach down the line has a gross weight of 28,000 pounds and a GCWR of 30,000 pounds. In other words, that coach can tow only 2000 pounds while at gross weight.
To get an idea of what sort of depreciation you might be looking at, try to find a coach that is two years older than the one you are looking at. Check www.pplmotorhomes.com/ for this. Scroll down a bit to Used RVs and Motor Homes by Brands and Models-Preowned Motorhomes & RVS for this part.
Keep up the research. I should probably make this sentence part of my signature, since I use it so often. I'd rather ask a thousand questions before writing a very large check than ask the same question a thousand times afterward.
Notice that "manual transmission", which is the same as "stick shift". Subaru automatics have never been flat towable.
Barb
Right, I meant a manual transmission, otherwise I could tow my current Forester. It's nice that there are no modifications required to tow with a manual trans.
Or perhaps I could tow a Forester, and beef it up light off-roading. Hmmmm.
-- Edited by bobk3d on Saturday 24th of October 2015 11:13:38 PM