I've heard of all kinds of problems with using bio-diesel over B5 in newer Diesel engineS. My warranty states that it does not cover damage caused by bio-diesel over 5%. With many states now giving tax breaks to producers for blending higher percentage product it is getting more difficult to find Petro diesel or even B5 in some areas of the country. My question is, are there any forum members out there that have actually experienced any other problems using the higher percentage fuels other than reduced mileage or performance?
Probably should mention that we have a 2014 Winnebago VIA on a Mercedes Benz chassi.
-- Edited by Cschwang on Saturday 30th of May 2015 03:58:48 PM
MarkS said
11:55 AM May 30, 2015
I don't use it in my truck even though Cummins approves my engine for B20. With 600K on my engine I don't want to take any chances that the biodiesel might break free deposits that might cause difficult problems to troubleshoot. However, it gets more difficult to pass up that cheap price everyday.
Trabuco said
01:58 PM May 30, 2015
No problems to date with my ISL, but don't have near the miles Mark has on his. I do use bio, but I have an older engine.
Cschwang said
04:10 PM May 30, 2015
Just took about a 500 mile trip thru Illinois and Iowa. Half the trip I could find real diesel and half I had to buy biodiesel. I got about 15% less mileage with the biodiesel. At $2.75/ gal for the bio I believe that would work out to be around $3.23/gal for petrodiesel. This is a situation where more is actually less.
Sushidog said
06:17 PM May 30, 2015
I used 5% bio in my Ford 6.4 once. I recorded a couple MPG less (19 mpg dropped to 17 mpg towing my Aliner) for a 10% loss, so I never used it again.
Chip
Bill and Linda said
11:26 AM May 31, 2015
We’ve used it, and up to B-20 is approved, in our truck but only when necessary.There is less energy in B-5 and even less in B-20.No issues, but I don’t choose to use it as it produces somewhat less power / MPG.(Just like ethanol does in gasoline.Less BTUs / unit of fuel.)
When researching the build of RAM 3500/5500HD trucks I spoke with the factory techs concerning the “B-20 option” for the Cummins and what that option did to make the truck Bio-capable.From the factory: “It just changes the calibration on the oil change interval algorithm, nothing else.” (i.e. when to change the oil.)I asked, why?“Because Bio-diesel is not as clean as regular diesel and therefor somewhat more frequent oil changes are necessary.”
I’ve not done the math for diesel, but like with ethanol in gas, I will bet when all factors are considered Bio is just as expensive, perhaps more so, as non-Bio fuel.One must count not only MPG, but oil changes as well in the cost analysis – at least according to RAM / Cummins.
Sushidog said
12:01 PM May 31, 2015
The way it was explained to me is that bio diesel has a higher boiling point than petro diesel so any blowby contamination in the oil does not evaporate as fast so it contaminates and thins the oil faster, requiring more frequent oil changes. My Ford manual says biodiesel use constitutes "extreme duty" requiring 5,000 mile oil changes as opposed to the "normal duty" oil change interval of 10,000 miles.
Chip
Cschwang said
01:27 PM May 31, 2015
Thanks Bill and Linda and Sushidog. Looks like biodiesel is here to stay and it means more cost in maintenance. That's the kind of information I was looking for. I ask almost everyone I talk to that has a motor home built on the Mercedes chassi about the fuel they use and most of the time I get a blank look. They just buy whatever the station is selling and truck on down the road. Maybe ingnorance is bliss, my wife thinks that I am over thinking the issue anyway.
I think the big agri-business lobby is behind the whole thing and it's all about money. They don't really care if it is good for the environment or not. They care about their pocket books only.
Bill and Linda said
01:47 PM May 31, 2015
FWIW, I’ve not found B-5 / B-20 to be all throughout the US as the only choice.We do travel quite a bit around the US and – in general – outside of a few states that have an economic interest in the product I don’t find it to be to difficult to avoid bio-diesel if that is a goal.Yes, it is here to stay, but not a prolific as might be imagined.
Mark S does much more travel then we do and can comment, but for the most part, just not really a problem to avoid if so desired when traveling through a particular area.
As to an “extreme duty” situation requiring oil changes at the 5,000 mile point – I’m just so old school – Towing “20K 5ers” around the US is what I consider “extremeduty” for pickups – regardless of brand.So at ~5K I change the oil even though the truck says we’re at the 50% point.Maybe another reason why after 160,000 miles we’ve had no engine issues of any kind.Who knows?
poppadog1955 said
06:36 AM Jan 17, 2017
I am a diesel mechanic we have a fleet of equipment and our supplier switched to bio diesel without our knowing. Within a few months we has several problems with fuel distribution to the engine. We found that Bio diesel will promote fungus growth in the tank, which clogs the intake screen in the tank we had to remove the tanks clean the screens as well as replace injectors and other items in the fuel system. NAPA makes a cleaner that you can put in your tank and kills the growth that is caused by Bio diesel. Since returning to the use of regular diesel a couple years ago and cleaning out systems out for several months (as it continues to cause problems after you stop using it) we have had no problems related to fuel. hope this helps
I've heard of all kinds of problems with using bio-diesel over B5 in newer Diesel engineS. My warranty states that it does not cover damage caused by bio-diesel over 5%. With many states now giving tax breaks to producers for blending higher percentage product it is getting more difficult to find Petro diesel or even B5 in some areas of the country. My question is, are there any forum members out there that have actually experienced any other problems using the higher percentage fuels other than reduced mileage or performance?
Probably should mention that we have a 2014 Winnebago VIA on a Mercedes Benz chassi.
-- Edited by Cschwang on Saturday 30th of May 2015 03:58:48 PM
Just took about a 500 mile trip thru Illinois and Iowa. Half the trip I could find real diesel and half I had to buy biodiesel. I got about 15% less mileage with the biodiesel. At $2.75/ gal for the bio I believe that would work out to be around $3.23/gal for petrodiesel. This is a situation where more is actually less.
Chip
We’ve used it, and up to B-20 is approved, in our truck but only when necessary. There is less energy in B-5 and even less in B-20. No issues, but I don’t choose to use it as it produces somewhat less power / MPG. (Just like ethanol does in gasoline. Less BTUs / unit of fuel.)
When researching the build of RAM 3500/5500HD trucks I spoke with the factory techs concerning the “B-20 option” for the Cummins and what that option did to make the truck Bio-capable. From the factory: “It just changes the calibration on the oil change interval algorithm, nothing else.” (i.e. when to change the oil.) I asked, why? “Because Bio-diesel is not as clean as regular diesel and therefor somewhat more frequent oil changes are necessary.”
I’ve not done the math for diesel, but like with ethanol in gas, I will bet when all factors are considered Bio is just as expensive, perhaps more so, as non-Bio fuel. One must count not only MPG, but oil changes as well in the cost analysis – at least according to RAM / Cummins.
Chip
Thanks Bill and Linda and Sushidog. Looks like biodiesel is here to stay and it means more cost in maintenance. That's the kind of information I was looking for. I ask almost everyone I talk to that has a motor home built on the Mercedes chassi about the fuel they use and most of the time I get a blank look. They just buy whatever the station is selling and truck on down the road. Maybe ingnorance is bliss, my wife thinks that I am over thinking the issue anyway.
I think the big agri-business lobby is behind the whole thing and it's all about money. They don't really care if it is good for the environment or not. They care about their pocket books only.
FWIW, I’ve not found B-5 / B-20 to be all throughout the US as the only choice. We do travel quite a bit around the US and – in general – outside of a few states that have an economic interest in the product I don’t find it to be to difficult to avoid bio-diesel if that is a goal. Yes, it is here to stay, but not a prolific as might be imagined.
Mark S does much more travel then we do and can comment, but for the most part, just not really a problem to avoid if so desired when traveling through a particular area.
As to an “extreme duty” situation requiring oil changes at the 5,000 mile point – I’m just so old school – Towing “20K 5ers” around the US is what I consider “extreme duty” for pickups – regardless of brand. So at ~5K I change the oil even though the truck says we’re at the 50% point. Maybe another reason why after 160,000 miles we’ve had no engine issues of any kind. Who knows?