There have been discussions in the past about credit cards. I'm here to revive the topic. In the last two short months we have had to cancel our credit card TWICE because of fraudulent charges! The first time (November) there was a charge from an online digital music service, and the second (this week) was for an international travel related charge. As a matter of fact, I caught the second charge while it was still pending and the credit card company had time to deny it. I highly encourage everyone, if offered by your credit card company, to go online and place every single solitary alert on your account possible. These alerts notified me in time to take action before more fraudulent charges could be made. Not only has this happened in the past 2 months, but we have had to cancel our credit card approximately 4 times in the last couple of years. This is the exact reason we have a back-up form of payment.
FWIW: The representative at our credit card company felt strongly that our credit card number was more than likely being stolen at fuel pumps. He suggested that, although inconvenient, we go inside to pay from now on.
Keep this in mind the next time you slip your credit card into a fuel pump.
Terry and Jo said
09:43 PM Jan 22, 2015
Maybe it is just us, but the few times we've seen our credit cards "hacked," there was no evidence it was done at a gas pump. One time we had things purchased three different times in a single Walmart store in Minnesota. We've never been to Minnesota, so I don't know how anyone there could have gotten our card information at a station in Oklahoma.
On the other hand, since we now bank with USAA, we've found that they watch the use of our cards for us. When we were moving from Oklahoma to Colorado, one leg of our trip saw us fill up the F450 at Stratford, Texas, again in either Texline, Texas or Clayton, NM on one day. When I went to fill up again at Raton, NM before going over Raton Pass, my card was declined. It seems that if we are going to be traveling and fueling up multiple times in one day (and likely in different states), we need to go online and inform USAA that we will be traveling and what time period that will be occurring. Since we do that now, we've had no problems with the cards.
Terry
Jo And Craig said
10:00 PM Jan 22, 2015
Terry, thieves are known to place very small card readers IN the fuel pumps. When people slip their credit card into the slot at the pump, the reader records the credit card number/information. It happens all the time. Fuel pumps are the only place we can come up with where our number is being stolen. As far as traveling from state-to-state, our credit card company is well aware that we are full time RVers and our card remains active wherever we travel. We have not been declined, yet. Finally, our credit card company has been VERY proactive in taking care of and looking out for us. Actually, we are impressed and quite happy with them. It just so happened I caught the last transaction before they did. Finally, they always overnight a new card to us wherever we are.
BiggarView said
05:59 AM Jan 23, 2015
Terry and Jo wrote:
Maybe it is just us, but the few times we've seen our credit cards "hacked," there was no evidence it was done at a gas pump. One time we had things purchased three different times in a single Walmart store in Minnesota. We've never been to Minnesota, so I don't know how anyone there could have gotten our card information at a station in Oklahoma.
Terry
It's not out of the realm of possibility that your card info was stolen at an OK gas station and then sold online at websites that trade such info and subsequently bought by somebody in MN, who then cloned your card and started spending on it until it was discovered. Time from theft to use on a fake card can take less than an hour. Point being, nodody is immune but the threat is real and even the clerk is not above stealing. Keep your card in sight at all times, and beware of any card reader that does not appear to be in it's original condition be it a gas pump or ATM. Check your card activity at least daily (takes but a minute to review... better safe than sorry, but doesn't require paranoia either.
Brian
lindy said
06:22 AM Jan 23, 2015
IMO gas pumps are the easiest to tell if someone has tampered with the card reader. Unless the pump is brand new the card reader will be all faded from the sun and dusty and dirty just like 99% of all fuel pumps you use. There's just no room for a jacker to slide another card reader in the existing slot, they have to put a secondary reader over the outside of the existing reader, and it will look a lot newer then the pump. I'd be more worried about getting jacked at say a restaurant, or ANY place I had to hand my card to another individual. There are very tiny hand held scanners that the jackers use and could easily jack you number and you'd never see them do it.
-- Edited by lindy on Friday 23rd of January 2015 06:25:08 AM
Diana and Jim said
06:52 AM Jan 23, 2015
Although not in this case, Jo...ATM's are another spot to watch for.
One of our cards sends us an email every time our number is used without the card present. If we buy something from someone like Amazon, we hit 'purchase' and we have an email back withing seconds from the credit card company. Nice feature!
Never thought of going inside to pay...good tip! Also, when accessing your accounts online, make sure you are not on wifi. Technomadia has good info on the dangers of campground wifi in their book...and how to avoid those dangers.
Jim
Jo and Ben said
08:44 AM Jan 23, 2015
We recently had fraudulent activity on a credit card and we were told by someone at the card company that another way crooks can get your card info is by walking past you with a scanner that can read into your wallet when it's in your back pocket. We figured this was the only way it could have happened since we had not been using that card, but in my husband's wallet it would have been the outer-most card with the wallet in his pocket. The card company guy suggested putting a piece of tin foil behind the credit cards to block the scanners from reading the card info.
BiggarView said
09:39 AM Jan 23, 2015
Those compact aluminum wallets are excellent protection also.
-- Edited by biggaRView on Friday 23rd of January 2015 09:57:41 AM
TRAILERKING said
09:47 AM Jan 23, 2015
biggaRView wrote:
Those compact aluminum wallets are excellent protectiion also.
With a matching "Tin Foil" hat.
BiggarView said
09:56 AM Jan 23, 2015
Yep, must not forget that!!
Terry and Jo said
10:02 AM Jan 23, 2015
I recall a commercial for a credit card protection company that showed a guy being able to open the door to the part of the pump where the card read is used and placing a device inside the housing. That kind of "reader" wouldn't be detected by looking for a new or extended looking outside reader slot.
On the other hand, when we had our Minnesota Walmart issue, it was with Jo's card and she seldom ever uses her card for refueling the trucks. Oddly enough, her cards have been hacked more than mine have, but then, she does more online shopping than I do. More times than not, if I have to replace a card, it is because it became unreadable or it cracked from how it is carried in my wallet.
Terry
PIEERE said
10:11 AM Jan 23, 2015
At the fuel pumps I use the lanes that the face the cashiers! I heard most crooks won't try to tamper with them where they can chance getting caught!
lindy said
11:38 AM Jan 23, 2015
Most fuel pumps anymore have some sort of a seal over the key hole, and or the face plate where it needs to be opened to access the card reader.
Someday said
11:38 AM Jan 23, 2015
FWIW: We had our credit card for 18 years no problem. Then within 3 months had it compromised twice late Sept & Nov 2013. First was a several thousand dollar charge for a time share type resort, that flagged as unusual charge so the credit card called us and said they'd caught it but they needed to deactivate our card (very inconvenient as we were within 3 days of leaving to travel!). Second time Nov 2013, checked my statement when we were in Fla and found lots of charges for taxi cabs NYC, 3 for the same burger joint in NYC, several hundred in Macys NYC and some NJ. We'd not been in NYC for 3 years. They had physically created a duplicate card, so likely used a card reader to enable that. Then in Osprey Walmart this December just gone, card was declined, called them to be told our card and many others had been compromised, albeit no charges showed on our statement. Had a very embarrassing conversation in the middle of Walmart trying to buy an iPad mini as a present.
Because our post code equates to a zip code of 00000 it doesn't work at any pump in the USA, so we have to go inside and try to guesstimate what the gas fill will be trying to avoid two exchange rates back and forth if we over estimate!! Hard with a huge RV Gas Tank! It's always been a bone of contention for us not being able to pay for convenience at the pump but I guess it's protected us somewhat when I think about it now.
Credit card company told us at all times, it's hard to know how it occurred but said fuel pumps had been a biggie on finding card readers. We are not to let our card out of our sight and ideally use the chip only (hard to do when very few businesses have this activated in the USA!). When we refuse to give our card to a waitress or business but insist on accompanying the card to the machine, they think we are weird folks. In Canada no businesses touch our cards any more, we have to do it as the owners with a pin. We even have mobile machines brought to our tables or accompany the waiter to the machine as is expected.
It's a sign of the times and I believe that no matter what changes are made, if the opportunity to scam a ton of money is there, the thieves will find a way around it. It's frustrating but what can be done other than being cognizant and trying to make it as hard as possible to get hit using precautions during use. If it wasn't for the travel points, I think I'd have stopped using a credit card altogether by now due to the hassles the past year and quarter.
Pierre that's a good tip on eyes on pumps, but with cameras recording folks at ATM's how the heck are they putting these readers on them?
Clay L said
12:06 PM Jan 23, 2015
Regarding online purchases. Bank of America administered credit cards are offered a service called ShopSafe. I use it for all online purchases. To use it you sign in to your BOA card account, then click on ShopSafe then sign in again to that site. Then you ask for a number and specify how many dollars can be charged to it and how long it will be valid. Unless you have specified that it can be used more than once it can only used once and only for a maximum amount you set. In either case it can only be used by one company. The charge on the number is keyed to and billed to your actual card number.
It seems to be a pretty safe way of buying online. My regular card has been compromised (actual fraudulent charges) once in the last ten years and cancelled by BOA as a cautionary measure (Home Depot, Target, etc) several other times , but ShopSafe generated numbers have never been misused.
As far as I know BOA in the only bank that offers the service. Citibank used yo have something similar but I don't think they still offer it.
-- Edited by Clay L on Friday 23rd of January 2015 12:06:45 PM
-- Edited by Clay L on Friday 23rd of January 2015 12:07:29 PM
Cindi said
12:16 PM Jan 23, 2015
Yes. there are cameras recording at ATM's, but nobody is watching them. It is only accessed/reviewed if there is something specific to look for, i.e. the police are looking for a bad guy.
I used to have Citibank and they would question a purchase if there had been several in one day. They denied the card at a store once (probably the third I had been to that day) and the clerk gave me the phone. After they talked with me and were sure it was me, they approved the transaction. When I traveled I had to notify them so my card would be allowed at gas stations and restaurants. My current company is not so vigilant but that may be because they want you to pay for a "protection service" to do what used to be standard service.
Barbaraok said
12:55 PM Jan 23, 2015
Diana and Jim wrote:
Although not in this case, Jo...ATM's are another spot to watch for.
One of our cards sends us an email every time our number is used without the card present. If we buy something from someone like Amazon, we hit 'purchase' and we have an email back withing seconds from the credit card company. Nice feature!
Never thought of going inside to pay...good tip! Also, when accessing your accounts online, make sure you are not on wifi. Technomadia has good info on the dangers of campground wifi in their book...and how to avoid those dangers.
Jim
We've come to realize that going inside saves us time because of the amount of fuel we get at each fill always goes over the limit for the credit card. Just easier to go in and get the pump authorized for $200 or so and fill up. And for the car, we generally use gift cards from the grocery stores (Safeway) in the area to get the 'cash' price at the pump.
The other thing I've realized is that we can expect to get a new card from one of the companies every year - just seems to be that way. The other thing we've done is take a large withdrawal from the ATM for the month for eating out, small purchases, etc.
Barb
kb0zke said
07:34 PM Jan 23, 2015
"We recently had fraudulent activity on a credit card and we were told by someone at the card company that another way crooks can get your card info is by walking past you with a scanner that can read into your wallet when it's in your back pocket." "...and ideally use the chip only (hard to do when very few businesses have this activated in the USA!)." These two statements are the two sides of the same security "coin." Take out your credit/debit cards and look for a symbol that looks like a series of ))) in increasing size or "blink" on it. If you find such, your card has an rf circuit in it. That device will let you make purchases without handing over your card. All that is necessary is that you bring the card near a card reader. No clerk ever touches your card. The other side of this is that anyone can buy a portable reader that can be hidden in a purse, briefcase, or backpack. Those readers sell for only a couple hundred dollars, and can capture several dozen cards in a matter of minutes in a crowded shopping mall. Some models can read at a distance of a couple of feet.
RFID is an ingenious system. The radio on the card, package, etc. can be built into the item because it doesn't require any battery. When a reader sends out a signal the hidden device responds. The device is pretty dumb, responding with only one response (the credit card info), but doing it faithfully every single time it is interrogated. It doesn't know WHO is interrogating it.
BTW, if you have a "credit card" passport, you have such a device. In that case, the response is your personal information. As was mentioned above, using an aluminum wallet (or wrapping the card in aluminum foil for the budget-conscious) is good protection.
For the time being, you can request a credit/debit card without the RF chip in it, but eventually you won't have that choice.
Camper Chronicles said
08:02 AM Jan 24, 2015
We use AmEx consistently (even though everyone doesn't take it) because they have a fantastic policy on fraud. Recently I was at a McDonald's and when I checked my bill the 4$ breakfast sandwich was a $14 charge. I was concerned because I hadn't kept the receipt but when I called AmEx they immediately credited it back. They also have a 30 day return policy on anything you buy with them and when we returned our Dish setup we got the credit to our account before the equipment arrived back at the vendor. They also text our phones when they see any suspicious activity and immediately stop or reverse those charges. Again I know everyone doesn't take them but for the peace of mind they are my absolute #1 choice.
RVKevi said
06:22 PM Jan 24, 2015
We had one of our cards used for a purchase we didn't make. The thing is, we've never used that card for gas purchases or for online purchases, only for purchases we've made in person. USAA took care of it for us. We're currently waiting for new cards for that account. But we're having a hard time trying to figure out how that happened. That card also got caught in the Home Depot hack last year, so that was the second time in a fairly short period of time we've had to replace them.
Jo And Craig said
07:44 PM Jan 24, 2015
I have but only one question... WHAT IS THIS WORLD COMING TO??????
jrzygrl64 said
09:47 PM Jan 24, 2015
I have an alert set up on our Chase cards - I get an email whenever the number is used without the card physically present, which means I get one if I make any phone or Internet orders. Good system I think. I wish our Sams mastercard had the same thing. We have been denied due to "suspicious activity" which was basically b/c we moved around so much but I just let them know that would be the norm and we haven't been denied again since.
There have been discussions in the past about credit cards. I'm here to revive the topic. In the last two short months we have had to cancel our credit card TWICE because of fraudulent charges! The first time (November) there was a charge from an online digital music service, and the second (this week) was for an international travel related charge. As a matter of fact, I caught the second charge while it was still pending and the credit card company had time to deny it. I highly encourage everyone, if offered by your credit card company, to go online and place every single solitary alert on your account possible. These alerts notified me in time to take action before more fraudulent charges could be made. Not only has this happened in the past 2 months, but we have had to cancel our credit card approximately 4 times in the last couple of years. This is the exact reason we have a back-up form of payment.
FWIW: The representative at our credit card company felt strongly that our credit card number was more than likely being stolen at fuel pumps. He suggested that, although inconvenient, we go inside to pay from now on.
Keep this in mind the next time you slip your credit card into a fuel pump.
Maybe it is just us, but the few times we've seen our credit cards "hacked," there was no evidence it was done at a gas pump. One time we had things purchased three different times in a single Walmart store in Minnesota. We've never been to Minnesota, so I don't know how anyone there could have gotten our card information at a station in Oklahoma.
On the other hand, since we now bank with USAA, we've found that they watch the use of our cards for us. When we were moving from Oklahoma to Colorado, one leg of our trip saw us fill up the F450 at Stratford, Texas, again in either Texline, Texas or Clayton, NM on one day. When I went to fill up again at Raton, NM before going over Raton Pass, my card was declined. It seems that if we are going to be traveling and fueling up multiple times in one day (and likely in different states), we need to go online and inform USAA that we will be traveling and what time period that will be occurring. Since we do that now, we've had no problems with the cards.
Terry
Terry, thieves are known to place very small card readers IN the fuel pumps. When people slip their credit card into the slot at the pump, the reader records the credit card number/information. It happens all the time. Fuel pumps are the only place we can come up with where our number is being stolen. As far as traveling from state-to-state, our credit card company is well aware that we are full time RVers and our card remains active wherever we travel. We have not been declined, yet. Finally, our credit card company has been VERY proactive in taking care of and looking out for us. Actually, we are impressed and quite happy with them. It just so happened I caught the last transaction before they did. Finally, they always overnight a new card to us wherever we are.
It's not out of the realm of possibility that your card info was stolen at an OK gas station and then sold online at websites that trade such info and subsequently bought by somebody in MN, who then cloned your card and started spending on it until it was discovered. Time from theft to use on a fake card can take less than an hour. Point being, nodody is immune but the threat is real and even the clerk is not above stealing. Keep your card in sight at all times, and beware of any card reader that does not appear to be in it's original condition be it a gas pump or ATM. Check your card activity at least daily (takes but a minute to review... better safe than sorry, but doesn't require paranoia either.
Brian
IMO gas pumps are the easiest to tell if someone has tampered with the card reader. Unless the pump is brand new the card reader will be all faded from the sun and dusty and dirty just like 99% of all fuel pumps you use. There's just no room for a jacker to slide another card reader in the existing slot, they have to put a secondary reader over the outside of the existing reader, and it will look a lot newer then the pump. I'd be more worried about getting jacked at say a restaurant, or ANY place I had to hand my card to another individual. There are very tiny hand held scanners that the jackers use and could easily jack you number and you'd never see them do it.
-- Edited by lindy on Friday 23rd of January 2015 06:25:08 AM
One of our cards sends us an email every time our number is used without the card present. If we buy something from someone like Amazon, we hit 'purchase' and we have an email back withing seconds from the credit card company. Nice feature!
Never thought of going inside to pay...good tip! Also, when accessing your accounts online, make sure you are not on wifi. Technomadia has good info on the dangers of campground wifi in their book...and how to avoid those dangers.
Jim
Those compact aluminum wallets are excellent protection also.
-- Edited by biggaRView on Friday 23rd of January 2015 09:57:41 AM
With a matching "Tin Foil" hat.
Yep, must not forget that!!
I recall a commercial for a credit card protection company that showed a guy being able to open the door to the part of the pump where the card read is used and placing a device inside the housing. That kind of "reader" wouldn't be detected by looking for a new or extended looking outside reader slot.
On the other hand, when we had our Minnesota Walmart issue, it was with Jo's card and she seldom ever uses her card for refueling the trucks. Oddly enough, her cards have been hacked more than mine have, but then, she does more online shopping than I do. More times than not, if I have to replace a card, it is because it became unreadable or it cracked from how it is carried in my wallet.
Terry
Because our post code equates to a zip code of 00000 it doesn't work at any pump in the USA, so we have to go inside and try to guesstimate what the gas fill will be trying to avoid two exchange rates back and forth if we over estimate!! Hard with a huge RV Gas Tank! It's always been a bone of contention for us not being able to pay for convenience at the pump but I guess it's protected us somewhat when I think about it now.
Credit card company told us at all times, it's hard to know how it occurred but said fuel pumps had been a biggie on finding card readers. We are not to let our card out of our sight and ideally use the chip only (hard to do when very few businesses have this activated in the USA!). When we refuse to give our card to a waitress or business but insist on accompanying the card to the machine, they think we are weird folks. In Canada no businesses touch our cards any more, we have to do it as the owners with a pin. We even have mobile machines brought to our tables or accompany the waiter to the machine as is expected.
It's a sign of the times and I believe that no matter what changes are made, if the opportunity to scam a ton of money is there, the thieves will find a way around it. It's frustrating but what can be done other than being cognizant and trying to make it as hard as possible to get hit using precautions during use. If it wasn't for the travel points, I think I'd have stopped using a credit card altogether by now due to the hassles the past year and quarter.
Pierre that's a good tip on eyes on pumps, but with cameras recording folks at ATM's how the heck are they putting these readers on them?
Regarding online purchases.
Bank of America administered credit cards are offered a service called ShopSafe. I use it for all online purchases. To use it you sign in to your BOA card account, then click on ShopSafe then sign in again to that site. Then you ask for a number and specify how many dollars can be charged to it and how long it will be valid. Unless you have specified that it can be used more than once it can only used once and only for a maximum amount you set. In either case it can only be used by one company. The charge on the number is keyed to and billed to your actual card number.
It seems to be a pretty safe way of buying online. My regular card has been compromised (actual fraudulent charges) once in the last ten years and cancelled by BOA as a cautionary measure (Home Depot, Target, etc) several other times , but ShopSafe generated numbers have never been misused.
As far as I know BOA in the only bank that offers the service. Citibank used yo have something similar but I don't think they still offer it.
-- Edited by Clay L on Friday 23rd of January 2015 12:06:45 PM
-- Edited by Clay L on Friday 23rd of January 2015 12:07:29 PM
I used to have Citibank and they would question a purchase if there had been several in one day. They denied the card at a store once (probably the third I had been to that day) and the clerk gave me the phone. After they talked with me and were sure it was me, they approved the transaction. When I traveled I had to notify them so my card would be allowed at gas stations and restaurants. My current company is not so vigilant but that may be because they want you to pay for a "protection service" to do what used to be standard service.
We've come to realize that going inside saves us time because of the amount of fuel we get at each fill always goes over the limit for the credit card. Just easier to go in and get the pump authorized for $200 or so and fill up. And for the car, we generally use gift cards from the grocery stores (Safeway) in the area to get the 'cash' price at the pump.
The other thing I've realized is that we can expect to get a new card from one of the companies every year - just seems to be that way. The other thing we've done is take a large withdrawal from the ATM for the month for eating out, small purchases, etc.
Barb
RFID is an ingenious system. The radio on the card, package, etc. can be built into the item because it doesn't require any battery. When a reader sends out a signal the hidden device responds. The device is pretty dumb, responding with only one response (the credit card info), but doing it faithfully every single time it is interrogated. It doesn't know WHO is interrogating it.
BTW, if you have a "credit card" passport, you have such a device. In that case, the response is your personal information. As was mentioned above, using an aluminum wallet (or wrapping the card in aluminum foil for the budget-conscious) is good protection.
For the time being, you can request a credit/debit card without the RF chip in it, but eventually you won't have that choice.
I have but only one question... WHAT IS THIS WORLD COMING TO??????
Sad times we live in for sure.