We purchased our first 5th wheel, it's a 2009 Bighorn 3410re and GVWR is 14000 as we understand, looking at all the truck and engine packages and we are looking at the 6.4 Hemi 2500 Ram rated around 15000 tow rating. the diesel looks to add a bit more tow rating but looking for some experienced rv folks that have knowledge in the numbers that are the best for our first tow vehicle.
Cowdog353 said
06:51 PM Oct 16, 2014
Ok you asked for an opinion, with the weight you stated , go with a diesel (Ford, Chevy, Dodge). A gas rig will do the job but with reservations, poor mileage and poor aceleration.
I drove a big rig back in my younger days and bought one of the first diesel pickup type trucks when they became available.
This is my highly biased opinion as I really believe when towing, a diesel is the only way to go, did I fail to mention the additional braking available with the modern Diesel engines.
Hope you make a decision that fits your style.
Good look,
Jim
KimandBob said
07:37 PM Oct 16, 2014
Thanks Jim we value your opinion. Enjoy the dream.
Sushidog said
07:10 AM Oct 17, 2014
Yes, a 2500 diesel can tow your rig, but you will certainly be more comfortable towing with a 1 ton dually diesel (your choice of brand.) Fully loaded, the pin weight of that Bighorn may approach or even exceed your proposed truck's capability. I have 2008 F-250 diesel rated to tow a 15,900lb 5er - yeah right. Assuming a 20% pin weight of 14,000 lbs. (the GVWR of your 5er) this means that about 2,800lb will be added to the bed (or r axle) My 250's payload capacity is only 2,730 lbs. this means that even without the weight of the hitch, anything in the bed, passenger, items in the cab, etc. it is already overloaded. Also consider the added stability of a dually, especially in adverse conditions and I'm sure you'll agree that for this trailer, it is a better choice.
Consider a quality used one if affordability is an issue. There are some deals out there if you look. I got my well maintained 100k mile 6.4l F-250 for only 11k - only about 20-25% "worn out" yet about 25% the cost of a new one, making it a great value, even if some minor repairs are needed. I purchased a 1 yr. extended warranty with mine (though thankfully I never had to use it) for peace of mind, as major diesel repairs aren't cheap.
Consider this quote from the Ford brochure: "Maximum Loaded Trailer Weight assumes a towing vehicle with any mandatory options, no cargo, tongue load of 10-15% (conventional trailer) or king pin weight of 15-25% (fifth-wheel trailer) and driver only (150 pounds). Weight of additional options, passengers, cargo and hitch must be deducted from this weight."
A 3/4 ton truck is great for towing a conventional TT or a light weight 5er but it's limited payload capacity is the weakest link for pulling larger 5ers.
Chip
KimandBob said
04:27 PM Oct 17, 2014
Thanks Chip with the few responses we received we will be looking for a 3500 series Dually weather a Ram 3500,F350,or Silverado 3500. maybe one of the members here can steer us to a good deal. thanks again.
Bill and Linda said
04:35 PM Oct 17, 2014
Will the gas be sort of OK?Probably. But if the budget will afford it the diesel will make you MUCH happier assuming you will be traveling and not moving the rig just two or three times a year.
I can’t emphasize how much better the diesel trucks are (any of the big 3) than the gas engines when towing almost anything. You have significantly more control and power when you need it including exhaust (turbo) brakes with any of the new diesels including the 2015 Ford diesel now.Then there is that big grin when you don’t struggle up a 6% grade with the gas engine screaming at high RPMs.And you will need it; especially when the 14,000lbs becomes 16,000+, etc.
My opinion with lots and lots of miles to back it up
Bill
Terry and Jo said
10:56 PM Oct 17, 2014
Another consideration on trucks other than gasoline or diesel is the height of the pickup bed rails. From what I've read, the GM and Dodge 3500 series have taller rails, thus affecting the distance between the bed rail and the underside of the fifth wheel's nose. I think I read somewhere that the Ford F350 has shorter bed rails.
Other than that, I have to agree with the others that the diesel will be much better than the gasoline. While it isn't necessarily a "fair comparison," we had a Ford F250 gasoline pickup pulling a 26-foot fifth wheel and it seemed that the engine was always "working hard" in pulling. Went to the diesel in a Ford F450 to tow our 38.5-foot Mobile Suites (GVWR 18,500 lbs) and the F450 doesn't even act like it is even hooked up to anything. (That is, until one gets to a mountain pass, then it seems to know.)
Terry
EdwinMcCainMessenger said
10:55 AM Oct 19, 2014
Taller/shorter rails? What is good? Thanks.
Bill and Linda said
01:34 PM Oct 19, 2014
Terry is referring to the distance between the truck’s upper bed rails and the bottom of the fifth wheel which goes over those rails and the truck bed.All of the new trucks, 2011 and beyond including the Ford, have relatively high bed rails as compared to earlier models of all three bands.I’ve measured them all recently all and they are all “high” without exception.
As all are within an inch or so as a practical matter whatever brand you purchase, if 2011 and later, can be pretty close and can contact the trailer even in normal driving situations, like in a turn coming down a ramp from an interstate.Most of us prefer to have 7” or more of clearance.6” is probably OK but less than 6” can be problematic.This isn’t pretty when the rails contact the trailer.
It is possible to have a trailer properly and safely raised, commonly call lifted, to solve this problem.MOR/ryde is one such company that does this “all the time.”But the process is not expensive and if you were purchasing a trailer new some OEM’s offer this as an option.I.e. having the trailer lifted 3” or more to eliminate this high bed rail problem and have the trailer run level with the truck.
So, pick you truck brand and then have the trailer lifted if required.Best of both worlds, whatever brand you like.
We purchased our first 5th wheel, it's a 2009 Bighorn 3410re and GVWR is 14000 as we understand, looking at all the truck and engine packages and we are looking at the 6.4 Hemi 2500 Ram rated around 15000 tow rating. the diesel looks to add a bit more tow rating but looking for some experienced rv folks that have knowledge in the numbers that are the best for our first tow vehicle.
I drove a big rig back in my younger days and bought one of the first diesel pickup type trucks when they became available.
This is my highly biased opinion as I really believe when towing, a diesel is the only way to go, did I fail to mention the additional braking available with the modern Diesel engines.
Hope you make a decision that fits your style.
Good look,
Jim
Thanks Jim we value your opinion. Enjoy the dream.
Consider a quality used one if affordability is an issue. There are some deals out there if you look. I got my well maintained 100k mile 6.4l F-250 for only 11k - only about 20-25% "worn out" yet about 25% the cost of a new one, making it a great value, even if some minor repairs are needed. I purchased a 1 yr. extended warranty with mine (though thankfully I never had to use it) for peace of mind, as major diesel repairs aren't cheap.
Consider this quote from the Ford brochure: "Maximum Loaded Trailer Weight assumes a towing vehicle with any mandatory options, no cargo, tongue load of 10-15% (conventional trailer) or king pin weight of 15-25% (fifth-wheel trailer) and driver only (150 pounds). Weight of additional options, passengers, cargo and hitch must be deducted from this weight."
A 3/4 ton truck is great for towing a conventional TT or a light weight 5er but it's limited payload capacity is the weakest link for pulling larger 5ers.
Chip
Will the gas be sort of OK? Probably. But if the budget will afford it the diesel will make you MUCH happier assuming you will be traveling and not moving the rig just two or three times a year.
I can’t emphasize how much better the diesel trucks are (any of the big 3) than the gas engines when towing almost anything. You have significantly more control and power when you need it including exhaust (turbo) brakes with any of the new diesels including the 2015 Ford diesel now. Then there is that big grin when you don’t struggle up a 6% grade with the gas engine screaming at high RPMs. And you will need it; especially when the 14,000lbs becomes 16,000+, etc.
My opinion with lots and lots of miles to back it up
Bill
Another consideration on trucks other than gasoline or diesel is the height of the pickup bed rails. From what I've read, the GM and Dodge 3500 series have taller rails, thus affecting the distance between the bed rail and the underside of the fifth wheel's nose. I think I read somewhere that the Ford F350 has shorter bed rails.
Other than that, I have to agree with the others that the diesel will be much better than the gasoline. While it isn't necessarily a "fair comparison," we had a Ford F250 gasoline pickup pulling a 26-foot fifth wheel and it seemed that the engine was always "working hard" in pulling. Went to the diesel in a Ford F450 to tow our 38.5-foot Mobile Suites (GVWR 18,500 lbs) and the F450 doesn't even act like it is even hooked up to anything. (That is, until one gets to a mountain pass, then it seems to know.)
Terry
Terry is referring to the distance between the truck’s upper bed rails and the bottom of the fifth wheel which goes over those rails and the truck bed. All of the new trucks, 2011 and beyond including the Ford, have relatively high bed rails as compared to earlier models of all three bands. I’ve measured them all recently all and they are all “high” without exception.
As all are within an inch or so as a practical matter whatever brand you purchase, if 2011 and later, can be pretty close and can contact the trailer even in normal driving situations, like in a turn coming down a ramp from an interstate. Most of us prefer to have 7” or more of clearance. 6” is probably OK but less than 6” can be problematic. This isn’t pretty when the rails contact the trailer.
It is possible to have a trailer properly and safely raised, commonly call lifted, to solve this problem. MOR/ryde is one such company that does this “all the time.” But the process is not expensive and if you were purchasing a trailer new some OEM’s offer this as an option. I.e. having the trailer lifted 3” or more to eliminate this high bed rail problem and have the trailer run level with the truck.
So, pick you truck brand and then have the trailer lifted if required. Best of both worlds, whatever brand you like.
BTW, these are very good questions.