My wife and I going to give full-timing a try. We've decided that a DP MH (w/ a Toad) is the best platform for our situation. We are starting to look at used late model ('09-'12) units. We like the Tiffin Phaeton 40 QTH floor plan - front salon, mid kitchen, rear bedroom, multi slides. It will only be the two of us so that general floor plan looks to be the best layout for us. Since we have no RV experience to speak of (we had a pop-up 25 yrs ago) we really don't know which brands/models are good ones and which are just shiny and pretty. There doesn't appear to be an objective rating source for RV's (like Consumer Reports), so we're interested in your opinions of which MH's to consider and, more importantly, which to avoid.
A couple of other questions:
How big a motor should a 40' unit have. I've seen 40' MH's listed with 340HP, 360HP, 380HP and 425HP? How big is big enough?
What features do you have that you couldn't live without? which are a waste?
What feature do you wish you had but don't?
Any and all help is appreciated.
Regards, Brad
bjoyce said
02:15 PM Mar 5, 2014
http://rv.org/ can be helpful. Brands - Winnebago/Itasca, Tiffin, Newmar and Entegra for the level you are looking at. I am not a fan of any motorhome made by Thor, Forest River or Coachman for heavy usage. Monaco/Holiday Rambler/Safari/Beaver and Fleetwood/American both were made by replacement companies after bankruptcy, so I do not know how good they are.
Side radiators are best. HP is not the way to choose, torque is the most important since it is hill climbing ability. An 09 or 10 might have a Cat engine, the 340HP might even be a Mercedes. For Cummins the ISC (300 to 380HP) has around 800 for torque, the ISL (350 to 450HP) has around 1200 torque. We have a 370HP ISL.
-- Edited by bjoyce on Wednesday 5th of March 2014 02:17:04 PM
BJBoyer22 said
03:42 PM Mar 5, 2014
Bill,
Thank you for your interest and your help. I don't know much but now I know more than I did before, so thank you. I'll concentrate our efforts in looking at the brands you've mentioned.
I've seen some of your other posts/replys and you seem very knowledgeable, not to mention helpful. Let me ask the same question but in reference to torque, how much is enough? Again, let's assume a 40 ft DP towing a Honda CRV. We intend to be full time. We believe we'll move a few hundred miles every two to four weeks as we vagabond around the country so MPG will not be paramount but comfort, reliability and adequate power are (I think) the most important. We don't want to be restricted in where we can go, we want to be able to climb the Rockies and the Sierra's without breaking or burning up something.
Next question: Do most manufacturers (in my price range) use the same chassis/suspension/motor/transmission? I see a lot of Freightliner chassises, Allison transmissions, and Cummins ISC's and ISL's mentioned in ads.
Regards, Brad
TRAILERKING said
03:53 PM Mar 5, 2014
I have the 8.3 Cummins, 330hp with the MD3060 Allison. Seems sufficient in the power department. Boots along quite well at 75mph down some of the Interstates I went on.
bjoyce said
04:44 PM Mar 5, 2014
The torque does not change with the horsepower. Many 40' DP owners have been happy with 3126 Cats (old C7), Cummins 8.3 (ISC) and even 300HP Mercedes diesel engines. They work fine. My in-laws had a 40' tag axle DP with a 350HP ICS and when we caravanned we followed because our ISL could pull hills better. But they still did OK on hills, just not as well as we do.
Freightliner is the major chassis manufacturer of DPs these days. We have a Spartan, which is still around and makes good chassis. Get into higher end or older motorhomes and you will find more chassis brands. A very few high end brands used something other than Allison, mostly to get more than 6 gears.
FT Dreamin said
05:13 PM Mar 5, 2014
We own a 1993 Foretravel and after two years of FT I am still impressed with quality construction. 20 years old EVERYTHING works beautifully and no rattles going down the road. Real wood, quality hardware and attention to detail in the construction. Look at a LOT of MH's, different brands, open drawers - see how they are made and how easily they function. Check out how well the doors fit and check for rattles during a test drive.
Must have's - washer/dryer! for FT - 40 footer
Have to agree about the side radiator
wish I had - less stuff - but I'm working on that!
Jake62 said
05:24 PM Mar 5, 2014
Brad,
I agree with Bill in these quality DPs: Entegra, Newmar, and Tiffin. You left out your budget, and that will certainly dictate the age and model for each manufacturer. We are also considering a used DP next year. For us, when we full-time, Entegra has the edge; however, we're not set in stone on that decision since we'll have a locate a quality used Entegra. My wife doesn't really care which manufacturer we go with since she's more interested in the travel/volunteer activities, so I've taken the lead on all the research, although she will certainly chime in when it comes time to selecting the floor plan
ps: Foretravel, Newell, and Prevost are in the upper end of DPs and certainly have outstanding quality, but you better be prepared to spend a large sum if you're looking at an '09 or newer.
kb0zke said
10:01 PM Mar 5, 2014
Welcome, Brad. You are where we were a couple of years ago. The top three brands for us were Bluebird Wanderlodge, Foretravel, and Newell. After having our Foretravel for a year now I'd go with either the Foretravel or Newell, but a 'Bird wouldn't be out of the question. All three build (or built, in the case of 'Birds) their own chassis.
As for features, we deliberately went with no slides. I realize that we're bucking the trend, but that's the way we like it. Other things are really your preference. Personally, I like the leveling system of the Foretravels and Newells better than that of the 'Birds. Both use the airbags as the leveling system, rather than hydraulic jacks like the 'Bird. I think you will find side radiators in most of these coaches, and that's the only way to go. Tag axle adds some additional mechanical complexity, takes some storage space, but give a better ride. We replaced the standard RV refrigerator with a residential unit. If you are into boondocking you probably will prefer the RV refrigerator, but if you stay where electricity is available I'd rather have the residential. Mostly anecdotal, but I'd avoid an RV refrigerator in a slide. Those seem to be the ones that have the fires.
Spend some time looking at various coaches and carefully look at the construction and details. "Live" in one (pretend to shower, wash dishes, etc.) and see what it is like. If you watch television a lot, see how comfortable it is. Over the years some manufacturers have put the television set in some pretty strange places.
If you get down to Houston be sure to check out PPL. You can spend quite a bit of time there, looking at all of their coaches.
Enjoy the research, and feel free to ask lots of questions.
TRAILERKING said
10:09 PM Mar 5, 2014
kb0zke wrote:
Welcome, Brad. You are where we were a couple of years ago. The top three brands for us were Bluebird Wanderlodge, Foretravel, and Newell. After having our Foretravel for a year now I'd go with either the Foretravel or Newell, but a 'Bird wouldn't be out of the question. All three build (or built, in the case of 'Birds) their own chassis.
As for features, we deliberately went with no slides. I realize that we're bucking the trend, but that's the way we like it. Other things are really your preference. Personally, I like the leveling system of the Foretravels and Newells better than that of the 'Birds. Both use the airbags as the leveling system, rather than hydraulic jacks like the 'Bird. I think you will find side radiators in most of these coaches, and that's the only way to go. Tag axle adds some additional mechanical complexity, takes some storage space, but give a better ride. We replaced the standard RV refrigerator with a residential unit. If you are into boondocking you probably will prefer the RV refrigerator, but if you stay where electricity is available I'd rather have the residential. Mostly anecdotal, but I'd avoid an RV refrigerator in a slide. Those seem to be the ones that have the fires.
Spend some time looking at various coaches and carefully look at the construction and details. "Live" in one (pretend to shower, wash dishes, etc.) and see what it is like. If you watch television a lot, see how comfortable it is. Over the years some manufacturers have put the television set in some pretty strange places.
If you get down to Houston be sure to check out PPL. You can spend quite a bit of time there, looking at all of their coaches.
Enjoy the research, and feel free to ask lots of questions.
Bluebird Wanderlodge's are nice. I wanted to get one too. The problem is they are out of business and parts are hard to find if you need. The reason they have a tag axle is because they are carrying around a huge, heavy Series 60 Detroit Diesel. The same as a highway coach(bus) MCI, Prevost, Etc.
kb0zke said
12:29 PM Mar 6, 2014
Bluebird is still very much in business, just not making motorhomes anymore. Engine/transmission parts are readily available from Detroit or Allison. Chassis parts are available from Bluebird. Coach parts are pretty much standard RV parts. Support is available from www.wanderlodgeownersgroup.com/forums/index.php for those who really want to know. Some of those on the forum have known 'Birds for 50 years. Others used to build them. Lots of knowledge there, and everyone is willing to share. You can post a picture of some part and within minutes someone will tell you what it is and where you can get one.
TRAILERKING said
12:18 PM Mar 7, 2014
Well actually when the plant closed. All the Wanderlodge parts were auctioned off. That's how you will find some rare stuff if you need. The people that bought up the parts are selling through the wanderlodge forum. If you're lucky you will find OEM parts. I know a guy on that forum bought a newer unit that was not completed and sold off in the auction. It was missing some much needed body panels/doors, etc. He actually custom made some parts because he couldn't find any. I followed that forum for a while when I was considering buying a Wanderlodge.
bjoyce said
12:50 PM Mar 7, 2014
Brad: Did you get the info you needed before the thread jumped off the rails?
The Restless Youngs said
11:35 PM Mar 7, 2014
We found the rv.org that Bill recommended earlier to be invaluable. With a quick filter in the database, it helped narrow down options very quickly and helped us focus on a handful of brands, many of which have been mentioned. We knew that we didn't want to buy new as there are a lot of nice used models just a couple of years old that would work great for us that were build for fulltiming.
folivier said
07:42 AM Mar 10, 2014
Trailerking said: "The reason they have a tag axle is because they are carrying around a huge, heavy Series 60 Detroit Diesel. The same as a highway coach(bus) MCI, Prevost, Etc. "
The engine is not the only reason for a tag. These are in the true bus class. Everything is heavier, beefier, and made to last for a million miles or more. My 1998 45' Newell weighs in at 48,000#. I've seen how they are built and it is amazing the quality put into not only the chassis but the entire unit. These are true full-time coaches and built to last for the long haul. But you have to pay for this quality.
Don't be concerned about getting a bit older one to get into your budget range. Just do your due diligence on any coach you're interested in. The way they were maintained and used is very important.
Greetings,
My wife and I going to give full-timing a try. We've decided that a DP MH (w/ a Toad) is the best platform for our situation. We are starting to look at used late model ('09-'12) units. We like the Tiffin Phaeton 40 QTH floor plan - front salon, mid kitchen, rear bedroom, multi slides. It will only be the two of us so that general floor plan looks to be the best layout for us. Since we have no RV experience to speak of (we had a pop-up 25 yrs ago) we really don't know which brands/models are good ones and which are just shiny and pretty. There doesn't appear to be an objective rating source for RV's (like Consumer Reports), so we're interested in your opinions of which MH's to consider and, more importantly, which to avoid.
A couple of other questions:
How big a motor should a 40' unit have. I've seen 40' MH's listed with 340HP, 360HP, 380HP and 425HP? How big is big enough?
What features do you have that you couldn't live without? which are a waste?
What feature do you wish you had but don't?
Any and all help is appreciated.
Regards, Brad
http://rv.org/ can be helpful. Brands - Winnebago/Itasca, Tiffin, Newmar and Entegra for the level you are looking at. I am not a fan of any motorhome made by Thor, Forest River or Coachman for heavy usage. Monaco/Holiday Rambler/Safari/Beaver and Fleetwood/American both were made by replacement companies after bankruptcy, so I do not know how good they are.
Side radiators are best. HP is not the way to choose, torque is the most important since it is hill climbing ability. An 09 or 10 might have a Cat engine, the 340HP might even be a Mercedes. For Cummins the ISC (300 to 380HP) has around 800 for torque, the ISL (350 to 450HP) has around 1200 torque. We have a 370HP ISL.
-- Edited by bjoyce on Wednesday 5th of March 2014 02:17:04 PM
Bill,
Thank you for your interest and your help. I don't know much but now I know more than I did before, so thank you. I'll concentrate our efforts in looking at the brands you've mentioned.
I've seen some of your other posts/replys and you seem very knowledgeable, not to mention helpful. Let me ask the same question but in reference to torque, how much is enough? Again, let's assume a 40 ft DP towing a Honda CRV. We intend to be full time. We believe we'll move a few hundred miles every two to four weeks as we vagabond around the country so MPG will not be paramount but comfort, reliability and adequate power are (I think) the most important. We don't want to be restricted in where we can go, we want to be able to climb the Rockies and the Sierra's without breaking or burning up something.
Next question: Do most manufacturers (in my price range) use the same chassis/suspension/motor/transmission? I see a lot of Freightliner chassises, Allison transmissions, and Cummins ISC's and ISL's mentioned in ads.
Regards, Brad
Freightliner is the major chassis manufacturer of DPs these days. We have a Spartan, which is still around and makes good chassis. Get into higher end or older motorhomes and you will find more chassis brands. A very few high end brands used something other than Allison, mostly to get more than 6 gears.
Must have's - washer/dryer! for FT - 40 footer
Have to agree about the side radiator
wish I had - less stuff - but I'm working on that!
Brad,
I agree with Bill in these quality DPs: Entegra, Newmar, and Tiffin. You left out your budget, and that will certainly dictate the age and model for each manufacturer. We are also considering a used DP next year. For us, when we full-time, Entegra has the edge; however, we're not set in stone on that decision since we'll have a locate a quality used Entegra. My wife doesn't really care which manufacturer we go with since she's more interested in the travel/volunteer activities, so I've taken the lead on all the research, although she will certainly chime in when it comes time to selecting the floor plan
ps: Foretravel, Newell, and Prevost are in the upper end of DPs and certainly have outstanding quality, but you better be prepared to spend a large sum if you're looking at an '09 or newer.
As for features, we deliberately went with no slides. I realize that we're bucking the trend, but that's the way we like it. Other things are really your preference. Personally, I like the leveling system of the Foretravels and Newells better than that of the 'Birds. Both use the airbags as the leveling system, rather than hydraulic jacks like the 'Bird. I think you will find side radiators in most of these coaches, and that's the only way to go. Tag axle adds some additional mechanical complexity, takes some storage space, but give a better ride. We replaced the standard RV refrigerator with a residential unit. If you are into boondocking you probably will prefer the RV refrigerator, but if you stay where electricity is available I'd rather have the residential. Mostly anecdotal, but I'd avoid an RV refrigerator in a slide. Those seem to be the ones that have the fires.
Spend some time looking at various coaches and carefully look at the construction and details. "Live" in one (pretend to shower, wash dishes, etc.) and see what it is like. If you watch television a lot, see how comfortable it is. Over the years some manufacturers have put the television set in some pretty strange places.
If you get down to Houston be sure to check out PPL. You can spend quite a bit of time there, looking at all of their coaches.
Enjoy the research, and feel free to ask lots of questions.
Bluebird Wanderlodge's are nice. I wanted to get one too. The problem is they are out of business and parts are hard to find if you need. The reason they have a tag axle is because they are carrying around a huge, heavy Series 60 Detroit Diesel. The same as a highway coach(bus) MCI, Prevost, Etc.
The engine is not the only reason for a tag. These are in the true bus class. Everything is heavier, beefier, and made to last for a million miles or more. My 1998 45' Newell weighs in at 48,000#. I've seen how they are built and it is amazing the quality put into not only the chassis but the entire unit. These are true full-time coaches and built to last for the long haul. But you have to pay for this quality.
Don't be concerned about getting a bit older one to get into your budget range. Just do your due diligence on any coach you're interested in. The way they were maintained and used is very important.