As my title suggests, I so far have nothing needed for living on the road - oh wait, I do have a propane lantern!
I am most interested in a 5th wheel, and of those 'toy haulers' is what I'm leaning towards. So my question:, since the much lower pricetags on used is so tempting, do most folks find it advantageous to shop for both truck & trailer as a "kit" - or is it better to seek them out as individual purchases?
The thought of a $40,000+ truck is rather dismaying :(
Thanks for any thoughts on this!
Restless
Terry and Jo said
08:17 AM Nov 28, 2013
Bruce,
That is always an option that many would like and few would find. I know of two consignment "units" with a dealership in Oklahoma that are made up of used trucks and used trailers. However, neither of which are toy haulers, but if you want to check them out they are at this site. Scroll down to the bottom of the "Inventory" page to see the two that have trucks within the package.
I should mention that I'm not sure that the two units are physically at Elk City as their owners may still have them.
I can say that Alicia and Slade, owners of Rolling Retreats, are great people and are getting an excellent reputation among the owners and prospective owners of DRV Suites trailers.
Terry
Dog Folks said
09:18 AM Nov 28, 2013
The other issue in getting a truck and a trailer: Is it properly matched? Within tow limits?
You don't want to buy a rig that is not matched properly and there a lot of them out there.
nomorsno said
06:58 PM Nov 28, 2013
The challenge is finding the combo unit with all the checks in all the right boxes as mentioned. I have seen a few combination units for sale but none that had everything we were looking for at the time. They were definitely more affordable for the units we looked at. 2 of those were estate sales so keep an eye out for those while you shop.
Another thought is perhaps the "horse" could be a motorhome and the cart an enclosed trailer. That way if you feel like a trip without the toys you still have a nice living space. So many options but I'm sure you'll find the "one". I have been in one toy hauler where people were carrying ATV's in the garage and the extra dirt and gas smell by the kitchen was not what I would want personally. That was only one unit though.
Have a good time with the search.
kb0zke said
03:09 PM Nov 29, 2013
The most common suggestion is to buy the trailer first, and then buy the truck needed to haul it. If you buy the truck first you are limited to getting a trailer that the truck can safely handle. Either way, don't believe the sales person about what the truck can handle. Get the actual numbers.
The biggest advantage to buying the truck first is that you can haul home the trailer when you finally find the right one. The biggest advantage to buying the trailer first is that you will know exactly how much truck you will need. One possible compromise is to start gathering weight information on the trailers that are of interest to you. Use the heaviest gross weight and the heaviest pin weight you find and buy a truck that will safely handle those loads.
Terry and Jo said
09:11 PM Nov 29, 2013
While I always give the advice to "choose" the trailer first, we did buy the truck first, but it was with the full knowledge that it would tow our 18,500 lb trailer. But, it was due diligence of really researching trucks, including the MDT's and the HDT's. Technically, the Ford F450 that we have is classified as an MDT, but it is at the lower end of that classification. Check out this link to see that different classifications and notice that they are rated based on the GVWR of the vehicle.
Now, there was a mention of knowing the numbers yourself and not relying on a salesman's claims, whether at the truck dealership or the RV dealership. The numbers that you want to be sure and not exceed are the truck's GCVW (Gross Combined Vehicular Weight) and the GAWR (Gross Axle Weight Rating). Do not let anyone fool you with "towing capacities." I can guarantee that if I hauled what the towing capacity on my F450 was, I would definitely be well over my GCVW, and my GCVW is 33,000 lbs.
Terry
kb0zke said
05:39 PM Nov 30, 2013
Thanks for clarifying, Terry. In addition, you need to know the actual weight of the truck AS YOU WILL BE USING IT. The weight of the truck's fuel, passengers, tools, etc. all need to be included. Some things can be carried either in the truck or the trailer (some tools, wheel chocks, etc.) while other things must be in one or the other (it is difficult to carry the truck's fuel in the trailer, or the fresh water in the truck). Also, sometimes one can move some of the trailer stuff around to add or remove pin weight. One can also try to keep the water tanks pretty empty while traveling. Many people travel with minimal fresh water, planning to fill up once they get to the campground. They carry enough for some use while on the road, but that's all. Others like to keep the fresh water tank full so that the coach is ready to go.
Like many things in life, rv weight is all about compromises. One of the best bits of advice I got was for motor homes, but it could be modified to fit others. Weigh the coach with full fuel, full fresh water, full propane and driver. Subtract that weight from the gross weight of the coach. That's how much other stuff can go in. Start with the actual weights of other passengers and weigh EVERYTHING that is carried into the coach. When you reach the weight limit stop adding stuff. If there is still stuff that you need, some of the other stuff has to come out. If a toad in used, make sure that the gross combined weight is not exceeded.
For towables, start with the actual weights of the truck as it is ready to go. Figure the actual towing capacity (gross combined weight minus the weight of the ready-to-go truck) to find the maximum the trailer can weigh. Use the LOWER of the trailer's gross weight or the number you just calculated. Subtract the actual weight of the trailer and you have the weight of the stuff that can go into the trailer. In this case the weight of the people is included in the truck weight, so you don't need to figure them again. No, you can't put the overweight loudmouth on the back bumper to lighten the pin load. <grin>
Figuring the weights really isn't all that hard, especially if you have accurate numbers to work with. If you have to estimate the weight of something, always estimate heavier.
Camper_Boy said
08:18 PM Nov 30, 2013
Hi Restless,
I to was back and forth with the trailer or truck first...We however did manage to put the package together to work for us. Terry is right to say find a trailer first, but we to bought the truck knowing it would be very capable to tow anything we would pick.
If you are trying to sort out the new vs. used thing...it is a personal decision. I can offer the substantial saving in a used scenario, but you need to consider that new does not guarantee you won't have problems.
If you would like additional help, please let me know...I think I can help you sort out some tough questions if you like.
Good Luck
Camper Chronicles said
08:28 PM Nov 30, 2013
We selected the trailer first after tons of research and a trip to an RV show to see in person, then species the truck to pull it which we are buying first with the trailer to come very close thereafter.
Restless said
07:32 AM Dec 1, 2013
Thanks folks,,,,,some really good thoughts there and I am chewing on them now.
I really appreciate the help here,,,,,I most def need some! :-/
As I look around at rigs the numbers seem rather daunting. Seems as tho the desire for a toy hauler puts me in the big category (35'+?) and that puts me in the heavy category along with the matching truck. I was never planning on needing such a powerhouse truck until now.
Anyway,,,,,,,thanks for the input and I didn't want you folks thinking that I'm ignoring my thread here!
thanks much!
kb0zke said
09:42 PM Dec 1, 2013
You aren't the only one to have these questions, and they do come up once in a while, so it is good to review this. Bill Gates can find the coach he likes and then buy a new truck to haul it and not even notice that he's spent any money. For the rest of us, everything is a balancing game. Spending more on the truck probably means spending less on the trailer. That may mean a smaller trailer, which may mean that a cheaper truck will work, which frees up money for a bigger trailer, which means a bigger truck is needed.
Probably the best arrangement is to find a floor plan that works for you. Then find the quality of coach that you want. At that point you can start looking for that floor plan from one of those builders. If you can't afford a new coach, look for a used one. Knowing the weights of the trailer you want will help you shop for the truck. Again, there is money to be saved by buying used. Take the VIN to a dealer and they should be able to look up exactly how the truck was built. There may also be a sticker with the weights, but by verifying with the VIN you will know for sure.
Sometimes you can find a truck/trailer combo for sale in Trailer Life or similar publications. Again, verify the numbers to make sure that there is enough truck for the trailer. Also, find out why the rig is for sale. You could end up with a wonderful matched set for much less than you could buy new, or you could end up with a horrible combination that only looks good when parked. Don't be taken in my the photographs, but there are some decent combinations to be had.
jrzygrl64 said
10:10 PM Dec 1, 2013
We have purchased our truck first, but as advised, we have our 5er narrowed down to 3, and they are all very similiar weights, so we know when we finally order one, our truck will be able to pull it just fine. Followed some good advise we found here on this forum - imagine that?
Also, just because one part of the "combo" deal isn't exactly what you would want, if one part of it is it doesn't hurt to ask if the seller will separate them. That is exactly how I found our truck. It was being sold as a combo deal, we weren't interested in the 5er b/c it was a toy hauler, so I just asked the guy if he would sell them separate, and (obviously) it worked out b/c we own the truck now! Then, the day we go to the notary to switch the title and register it, we are waiting in line and the guy says to us "I hope I don't have to move the 5er before we sell it, I have no way to move it now". I almost hit the panic button b/c I thought he was backing out of the deal, but he didn't and hubby drove it home! I have no idea what he will do if the lot he has it on wants him to move it, but I guess he will figure it out.
Good luck in your search!
Restless said
06:45 PM Dec 2, 2013
Good stuff you guys! :)
And I do see the circle ;)
Hello :)
As my title suggests, I so far have nothing needed for living on the road - oh wait, I do have a propane lantern!
I am most interested in a 5th wheel, and of those 'toy haulers' is what I'm leaning towards. So my question:, since the much lower pricetags on used is so tempting, do most folks find it advantageous to shop for both truck & trailer as a "kit" - or is it better to seek them out as individual purchases?
The thought of a $40,000+ truck is rather dismaying :(
Thanks for any thoughts on this!
Restless
Bruce,
That is always an option that many would like and few would find. I know of two consignment "units" with a dealership in Oklahoma that are made up of used trucks and used trailers. However, neither of which are toy haulers, but if you want to check them out they are at this site. Scroll down to the bottom of the "Inventory" page to see the two that have trucks within the package.
Rolling Retreats in Elk City, Oklahoma
I should mention that I'm not sure that the two units are physically at Elk City as their owners may still have them.
I can say that Alicia and Slade, owners of Rolling Retreats, are great people and are getting an excellent reputation among the owners and prospective owners of DRV Suites trailers.
Terry
You don't want to buy a rig that is not matched properly and there a lot of them out there.
The challenge is finding the combo unit with all the checks in all the right boxes as mentioned. I have seen a few combination units for sale but none that had everything we were looking for at the time. They were definitely more affordable for the units we looked at. 2 of those were estate sales so keep an eye out for those while you shop.
Another thought is perhaps the "horse" could be a motorhome and the cart an enclosed trailer. That way if you feel like a trip without the toys you still have a nice living space. So many options but I'm sure you'll find the "one". I have been in one toy hauler where people were carrying ATV's in the garage and the extra dirt and gas smell by the kitchen was not what I would want personally. That was only one unit though.
Have a good time with the search.
The biggest advantage to buying the truck first is that you can haul home the trailer when you finally find the right one. The biggest advantage to buying the trailer first is that you will know exactly how much truck you will need. One possible compromise is to start gathering weight information on the trailers that are of interest to you. Use the heaviest gross weight and the heaviest pin weight you find and buy a truck that will safely handle those loads.
While I always give the advice to "choose" the trailer first, we did buy the truck first, but it was with the full knowledge that it would tow our 18,500 lb trailer. But, it was due diligence of really researching trucks, including the MDT's and the HDT's. Technically, the Ford F450 that we have is classified as an MDT, but it is at the lower end of that classification. Check out this link to see that different classifications and notice that they are rated based on the GVWR of the vehicle.
Truck Classifications
Now, there was a mention of knowing the numbers yourself and not relying on a salesman's claims, whether at the truck dealership or the RV dealership. The numbers that you want to be sure and not exceed are the truck's GCVW (Gross Combined Vehicular Weight) and the GAWR (Gross Axle Weight Rating). Do not let anyone fool you with "towing capacities." I can guarantee that if I hauled what the towing capacity on my F450 was, I would definitely be well over my GCVW, and my GCVW is 33,000 lbs.
Terry
Like many things in life, rv weight is all about compromises. One of the best bits of advice I got was for motor homes, but it could be modified to fit others. Weigh the coach with full fuel, full fresh water, full propane and driver. Subtract that weight from the gross weight of the coach. That's how much other stuff can go in. Start with the actual weights of other passengers and weigh EVERYTHING that is carried into the coach. When you reach the weight limit stop adding stuff. If there is still stuff that you need, some of the other stuff has to come out. If a toad in used, make sure that the gross combined weight is not exceeded.
For towables, start with the actual weights of the truck as it is ready to go. Figure the actual towing capacity (gross combined weight minus the weight of the ready-to-go truck) to find the maximum the trailer can weigh. Use the LOWER of the trailer's gross weight or the number you just calculated. Subtract the actual weight of the trailer and you have the weight of the stuff that can go into the trailer. In this case the weight of the people is included in the truck weight, so you don't need to figure them again. No, you can't put the overweight loudmouth on the back bumper to lighten the pin load. <grin>
Figuring the weights really isn't all that hard, especially if you have accurate numbers to work with. If you have to estimate the weight of something, always estimate heavier.
Hi Restless,
I to was back and forth with the trailer or truck first...We however did manage to put the package together to work for us. Terry is right to say find a trailer first, but we to bought the truck knowing it would be very capable to tow anything we would pick.
If you are trying to sort out the new vs. used thing...it is a personal decision. I can offer the substantial saving in a used scenario, but you need to consider that new does not guarantee you won't have problems.
If you would like additional help, please let me know...I think I can help you sort out some tough questions if you like.
Good Luck
Thanks folks,,,,,some really good thoughts there and I am chewing on them now.
I really appreciate the help here,,,,,I most def need some! :-/
As I look around at rigs the numbers seem rather daunting. Seems as tho the desire for a toy hauler puts me in the big category (35'+?) and that puts me in the heavy category along with the matching truck. I was never planning on needing such a powerhouse truck until now.
Anyway,,,,,,,thanks for the input and I didn't want you folks thinking that I'm ignoring my thread here!
thanks much!
Probably the best arrangement is to find a floor plan that works for you. Then find the quality of coach that you want. At that point you can start looking for that floor plan from one of those builders. If you can't afford a new coach, look for a used one. Knowing the weights of the trailer you want will help you shop for the truck. Again, there is money to be saved by buying used. Take the VIN to a dealer and they should be able to look up exactly how the truck was built. There may also be a sticker with the weights, but by verifying with the VIN you will know for sure.
Sometimes you can find a truck/trailer combo for sale in Trailer Life or similar publications. Again, verify the numbers to make sure that there is enough truck for the trailer. Also, find out why the rig is for sale. You could end up with a wonderful matched set for much less than you could buy new, or you could end up with a horrible combination that only looks good when parked. Don't be taken in my the photographs, but there are some decent combinations to be had.
We have purchased our truck first, but as advised, we have our 5er narrowed down to 3, and they are all very similiar weights, so we know when we finally order one, our truck will be able to pull it just fine. Followed some good advise we found here on this forum - imagine that?
Also, just because one part of the "combo" deal isn't exactly what you would want, if one part of it is it doesn't hurt to ask if the seller will separate them. That is exactly how I found our truck. It was being sold as a combo deal, we weren't interested in the 5er b/c it was a toy hauler, so I just asked the guy if he would sell them separate, and (obviously) it worked out b/c we own the truck now! Then, the day we go to the notary to switch the title and register it, we are waiting in line and the guy says to us "I hope I don't have to move the 5er before we sell it, I have no way to move it now". I almost hit the panic button b/c I thought he was backing out of the deal, but he didn't and hubby drove it home! I have no idea what he will do if the lot he has it on wants him to move it, but I guess he will figure it out.
Good luck in your search!
And I do see the circle ;)
It all makes sense, and much EXPENSE too!
thanks for your thoughts,,,good stuff
Bruce