I say this with concern for all – The Pressure Pro’s won’t prevent a blow out if the tire just “goes” and many “RV trailer tires” will blow even if properly inflated.In addition to the Pressure Pro or like kind sensors, consider replacing the “E” or if you have “G” tires on the rig, nice big rig it is, with some G114 “H” tires.Yes, they are over kill by specifications and expensive, but they won’t “blow out” and they will last 45,000+ miles.Use the proper inflation table for the lighter weight they will be carrying and all will be good.
Sure has worked for Howard and the rest of us that made those tire changes a long time ago.
Just saying . . .
Bill
-- Edited by Bill and Linda on Wednesday 17th of October 2012 06:49:08 PM
Bill and Linda said
06:17 PM Oct 16, 2012
WestWardHo wrote:
Bill, Can you explain the "G114 H Tires" better, please?
Thanks, ~Sherry
OK, here we go. The Goodyear G114 “H” tire is a commercial grade (not listed in the Goodyear “RV Catalog”) heavy grade truck / trailer tire.It has a load rating of up to 4,805 lbs per tire assuming it is inflated to its maximum pressure of 125 psi.You would not inflate it to this level.You would inflate all tires based on the maximum weight on the heaviest tire.In most cases that’s like 100 psi or so.
It is what we used to call a 16 ply tire and is extremely strong in the side wall area which is where most of the “G” tires fail even if properly inflated.If you ever compare this tire to a “G” tire you will see just how impressive these tires are and why they seldom fail.
It requires a new wheel / rim due to the tire but it is still a standard 8 bolt pattern and is a takeoff / put on upgrade.I.e. you don’t have to modify anything.Also, and I am not recommending you drive at 75 MPH, but did you know that many “RV tires” are speed limited to 65MPH?The “H” tires are rated to 75.Nice to have that cushion IMO.
Remember, the carrying capacity of your trailer is not raised by upgrading tires.If you axles are 7K axles, then the rating is 7K for the axle even though the tires could be over 8K.
This is NOT an inexpensive upgrade.However, if you do it you probably will never purchase another tire for your rig unless you go over 50,000 miles or exceed 6-7 years of tire age when all tires should be replaced.
There is a lot more to this and I would be pleased to answer any PM’s on the subject, but here is Howard post concerning this issue:
There are some links in this post.I recommend you look at them as well.The bottom line is, while important in some ways, all the tire monitor systems will do is tell you there is a leak in so many words - or a change in pressure.They will not prevent a sidewall tire failure such as you indicate you may have had.So, like I have advised my RV friends, this is expensive, and well worth it IF you travel.If the trailer just sits most of the time, maybe not as much expense wise - although "I" would still do it.
BTW, some will tell you the tire is too “heavy” and the trailer will not ride well.They are wrong.That’s why you inflate them properly based on weight.
Finally, be careful about some “J” tires.They also have a lower speed limit when you inflate them below 125PSI. But they cost less - wonder why.
Probably said too much, but I have seen what these tires can do on roads you probably have only seen on “Ice Road Truckers.”My “H” tires didn’t have issues on those roads, others – not so good.So I am just trying to keep people from having issues and maybe a lot of damage to their rig.
Happy to provide more info but maybe Howard will take it from here.He “does” tires now.
Safe Travels
Bill
Edit to activate link
-- Edited by Bill and Linda on Tuesday 16th of October 2012 06:21:04 PM
-- Edited by Bill and Linda on Tuesday 16th of October 2012 09:32:33 PM
WestWardHo said
10:54 PM Oct 16, 2012
Oh joy, sitting on the side of I-10 highway between Tucson & Phoenix waiting for AAA RV Plus (sure hope they're good!!) to come and repair rear driver's side wheel blow out on rig. Some what appears to be minor damage to rig. Where are the Pressure Pro monitors when we need them?!
~Sherry & Jesse & Nellie & Paris
WestWardHo said
12:02 AM Oct 17, 2012
Bill, Can't thank you enough. We'll look into it. Sure looked like a tire failure to me but we'll see when we get home. We will definitely look into higher grade tires.
~sherry
Ps AAA RV Plus was great service, whew!
WestWardHo said
12:05 AM Oct 17, 2012
Bill, Can you explain the "G114 H Tires" better, please?
Thanks, ~Sherry
Lucky Mike said
12:11 AM Oct 17, 2012
I second the Tire upgrade......it is well worth it in the long run..........BUT.........I also believe highly in tire pressure monitors , the cost of a unit and components is less than one blowout, one Bad bearing ,bad brake or stuck Caliper.....not to mention body damage and loss of use if it becomes real bad!!!!
Life is always beautiful and it always happens to the other guy..............until its your turn!!!............Be prepared, it wont hurt so much!!
Racerguy said
01:55 AM Oct 17, 2012
They say there are 2 types of RV'rs....Those that have had a blowout and those that will.
FastEagle said
09:58 AM Oct 17, 2012
The reference provided below is from Bridgestone. However, it is the best document found on the internet explaining just how “plus sizing” tire procedures are applied. Even though it is not addressing trailer tires in particular, the procedures apply because all of the industry standards and DOT regulations are being followed.
Plus sizing starts on page 15. Use all information that applies to the situation at hand. Appendixes A-2, A-3 and A-4 apply.
-- Edited by Terry and Jo on Wednesday 17th of October 2012 10:24:43 AM
K & E said
10:46 PM Oct 17, 2012
We just had the third G tire on our 2008 Jayco Designer fail in an 18 month period. Two of them had the tread peel off and the tire stayed inflated. The third one had the tread peel off and it blew. Two of these instances have caused damage to our 5th wheel. We are filing our third claim with Goodyear. They paid for the first tire and damage completely, paid for 50% of the second tire and now we'll see what happens with this third instance. We are also asking them to pay for the 4th tire which we have replaced because we sure don't trust that tire. We think we got a bad batch of tires. I've never heard of anyone having this much trouble with the G tires. We just paid $460 for the new tire. I'm curious how much more an H rated tire would be. Thanks for any input!
Bill and Linda said
11:11 PM Oct 17, 2012
K & E wrote:
We just had the third G tire on our 2008 Jayco Designer fail in an 18 month period. Two of them had the tread peel off and the tire stayed inflated. The third one had the tread peel off and it blew. Two of these instances have caused damage to our 5th wheel. We are filing our third claim with Goodyear. They paid for the first tire and damage completely, paid for 50% of the second tire and now we'll see what happens with this third instance. We are also asking them to pay for the 4th tire which we have replaced because we sure don't trust that tire. We think we got a bad batch of tires. I've never heard of anyone having this much trouble with the G tires. We just paid $460 for the new tire. I'm curious how much more an H rated tire would be. Thanks for any input!
I have.Many people have had lots of trouble with “G” tires.It is not a “bad batch,” IMO, and it is not just "Goodyear." It is the tire, again, IMO.
For $460 you would be closer than you think to the cost of an “H” tire and an Aluminum High-Spec Wheel at least last fall when I purchase 4 new ones after 45,000 miles. They were not ready to be replaced at 45,000 miles. I just did because of other factors not related to the "H" tire.
OK here goes, you asked: Try Trailer Tire and Wheel -(419) 272-2277Ask for Scott – tell him what you are replacing and you want G114 “H” tires and wheels for same.He knows his stuff and may ask a couple of questions to make sure of fit, etc. FWIW, I have ordered via phone and received exactly what I asked for. I have also been physically to his shop. Nice people and fair pricing. However, these tires ARE expensive.
This is where Howard, Jack, I and others have acquired “H” tires, on new High Spec wheels, mounted balanced and ready to install via UPS.
They ship UPS and so far no one who I know of who has dealt with Scott has been disappointed.
Hope this helps with your decision as to what to do next.
Good luck
Bill
WestWardHo said
12:03 AM Oct 18, 2012
Bill and the rest of you! Can't thank you enough for the generous sharing of information about tires.
~Sherry
FastEagle said
12:27 AM Oct 18, 2012
While this thread is running and weight by axle end has been mentioned I’m going to use that open door to present another point of view on that subject.
Toyo sells a lot of tires to the motorized RV community. Their take on DOT regulations leads me to believe they have an active legal department.
Here is the reference. If you should be using some of their RV tires this reference is required reading.
While this thread is running and weight by axle end has been mentioned I’m going to use that open door to present another point of view on that subject.
Toyo sells a lot of tires to the motorized RV community. Their take on DOT regulations leads me to believe they have an active legal department.
Here is the reference. If you should be using some of their RV tires this reference is required reading.
-- Edited by Terry and Jo on Thursday 18th of October 2012 07:04:39 AM
Bob said
01:25 AM Oct 18, 2012
We called Scott based on Bill's advice a last year. We have a 07 Cameo and usually stay around 14, 000 lbs. It came with E tires and they looked great when we purchased it used. We had gone through Chinese E tires with a previous trailer so the first thing was to replace the tires. Scott sent us new Goodyear G614 tires made in the USA. My local tire guy mounted them and then sold the old tires for $50 each and gave me the credit on 4 new tires for the DRW to match the front tires that were near new. The Goodyears have been on over a year with no problems. So give Scott a call for good advice. Bob
FastEagle said
10:16 AM Oct 18, 2012
K & E wrote:
We just had the third G tire on our 2008 Jayco Designer fail in an 18 month period. Two of them had the tread peel off and the tire stayed inflated. The third one had the tread peel off and it blew. Two of these instances have caused damage to our 5th wheel. We are filing our third claim with Goodyear. They paid for the first tire and damage completely, paid for 50% of the second tire and now we'll see what happens with this third instance. We are also asking them to pay for the 4th tire which we have replaced because we sure don't trust that tire. We think we got a bad batch of tires. I've never heard of anyone having this much trouble with the G tires. We just paid $460 for the new tire. I'm curious how much more an H rated tire would be. Thanks for any input!
I just reciently completed a blog posting on thr tire conditions you have posted. Here is a link to the post.
Several months ago, I also switched out the Goodyear G tires and 16" wheels on my Carri-Lite for the 17.5 High-Spec wheels and Goodyear G114 tires. I also purchased mine from trailer tires and wheels. I paid a little over $3000.00 for 5 tires and wheels (I also replaced the spare tire and wheel). I was very happy with the entire purchase process, and I love the new tires and wheels. I have about 5000 miles on them and they still look brand new. BTW, you may find that the shipping can be greatly reduced if you can have the tires and wheels shipped to a business address, (say, a trusted mechanic). That cut my shipping charge significantly.
Bill and Linda said
10:41 PM Oct 18, 2012
In the FWIW perspective department as pertains to cost / budget – If it were me and I was purchasing “H” to replace “G”, unless the spare is very old, I wouldn’t necessarily replace the spare “G” tire.
I know this can be discussed both ways and neither is totally right or wrong.If you have the budget for 5, then by all means get 5 new tires and wheels.But IMO if the budget didn’t allow for 5 tires and wheels, but could swing 4, then get upgraded tires and wheels and forgo the upgraded spare until the budget can afford it.
You can put a “G” tire on an axle with an “H” on the other axle.They physically clear.Not an issue.(I have physically checked to make sure as well as reading the specifications for both the tire and wheel diameters.)
My perspective – FWIW
Bill
K & E said
08:50 PM Oct 19, 2012
FastEagle: Thanks for the link to your blog. You write about ST tires. We have LT tires which are supposedly light truck tires, not trailer tires. I don't know if the same information applies. My husband is adamant about checking to make sure they are properly inflated and does not travel over the recommended maximum 65 mph. I don't believe we were to blame for these tire failures.
WestWardHo said
07:12 PM Oct 20, 2012
So Jesse took the blown tire to a dealer here in town. They said it was the cheapest trailer tire one could have possibly put on a trailer and it would have failed no matter what. BTW, we were no driving over 65 and our rig had just been weighed by H & L at the rally and we were not overweight anywhere. The other three tires and what was the spare are good "medium" quality tires and we have "heavy duty high pressure (up to 125 lbs) wheels. From links on the topic looks like we can get Goodyear G614-RST tires based on wheel size. Although I've read everything about tires on here, I'm a girl and I don't get it! Opinions on the G614's on our current wheels please.
~Sherry
Bill and Linda said
10:24 PM Oct 20, 2012
WestWardHo wrote:
Opinions on the G614's on our current wheels please.
~Sherry
I would replace all G614 “G” tires with G114 “H” tires.As I have said, G114 tires and wheels are expensive, but unlike the G614 tires they won’t blow due to weak side walls.(“G” replacing “E” tires is another discussion.)
You can’t put G114 tires on your present wheels assuming you have G614 tires now.The wheels must be replaced along with the tires.
The problem with the “G” tires is the side wall.They meet the static specifications but not the dynamic issues when rolling and under load. Anyone ever seen a tire blow out sitting still?That’s the reason for upgrading to the “H” tires when you have a “big rig” such as yours, IMO.
That’s my opinion as requested and what I and Howard did among others.It is worth the money and the additional safety – specifications from the manufacture or DOT aside.
My 2 cents
Bill
FastEagle said
06:03 AM Jan 31, 2013
K & E wrote:
FastEagle: Thanks for the link to your blog. You write about ST tires. We have LT tires which are supposedly light truck tires, not trailer tires. I don't know if the same information applies. My husband is adamant about checking to make sure they are properly inflated and does not travel over the recommended maximum 65 mph. I don't believe we were to blame for these tire failures.
Better late than never.
I enjoy the wildlife pictures in your blog. I've added it to the reading list in my blog.
Once a tire of any design is used on the RV trailer axle it becomes a trailer tire and must conform to the fitment regulations for those axles. The GY G614 is basically a hybrid ST tire skinned as an LT.
The overwhelming majority of tread separations are caused by excessive heat build-up. A tire forensic expert can tell you in a flash if a tread separation was caused by a defect or misuse.
One of the things most often avoided in trailer tire discussions is how fast tires used in that position will degrade. One of the most prolific manufacturers of ST tires is on record as saying that ST tires in normal use will lose one third of their strength in three years. RV trailer manufacturers are not very good about providing much - if any - load capacity reserves with their tire selections. So, people in that situation, loading their trailers right up close to the maximum cargo capacity may be operating on overloaded tires within a year.
A little food while I'm at it. Trailer brakes are not very reliable. Connected up to a controller that is not very reliable may compound into a problem that is not easily detectable. Heated brake assemblies will dissipate that heat into the rims and then the tires. Doing a rest area walk around upon arrival may not reveal a hot brake situation. We normally stay in rest areas 15 - 20 minutes on normal stops. We walk to the facilities just to help get the juices flowing. Just before leaving is when I do my walk around. A hot brake situation will be detectable in tire heat by then.
FastEagle
Jack Mayer said
10:05 AM Jan 31, 2013
I realize this is an old thread, but since it has been brought back "up"......
If you have a heavy trailer then I would also recommend going to the G114 tires and upgrade the wheels. It is money well worth spending if you live your life on the road.
Personally, I would NEVER put on a G614 tire. I have seen far too many issues with them. Especially if you are anywhere near the upper 25% of their rating. JMO. But based on long, hard experience and research.
-- Edited by Jack Mayer on Thursday 31st of January 2013 10:08:01 AM
I say this with concern for all – The Pressure Pro’s won’t prevent a blow out if the tire just “goes” and many “RV trailer tires” will blow even if properly inflated. In addition to the Pressure Pro or like kind sensors, consider replacing the “E” or if you have “G” tires on the rig, nice big rig it is, with some G114 “H” tires. Yes, they are over kill by specifications and expensive, but they won’t “blow out” and they will last 45,000+ miles. Use the proper inflation table for the lighter weight they will be carrying and all will be good.
Sure has worked for Howard and the rest of us that made those tire changes a long time ago.
Just saying . . .
Bill
-- Edited by Bill and Linda on Wednesday 17th of October 2012 06:49:08 PM
OK, here we go. The Goodyear G114 “H” tire is a commercial grade (not listed in the Goodyear “RV Catalog”) heavy grade truck / trailer tire. It has a load rating of up to 4,805 lbs per tire assuming it is inflated to its maximum pressure of 125 psi. You would not inflate it to this level. You would inflate all tires based on the maximum weight on the heaviest tire. In most cases that’s like 100 psi or so.
It is what we used to call a 16 ply tire and is extremely strong in the side wall area which is where most of the “G” tires fail even if properly inflated. If you ever compare this tire to a “G” tire you will see just how impressive these tires are and why they seldom fail.
It requires a new wheel / rim due to the tire but it is still a standard 8 bolt pattern and is a takeoff / put on upgrade. I.e. you don’t have to modify anything. Also, and I am not recommending you drive at 75 MPH, but did you know that many “RV tires” are speed limited to 65MPH? The “H” tires are rated to 75. Nice to have that cushion IMO.
Remember, the carrying capacity of your trailer is not raised by upgrading tires. If you axles are 7K axles, then the rating is 7K for the axle even though the tires could be over 8K.
This is NOT an inexpensive upgrade. However, if you do it you probably will never purchase another tire for your rig unless you go over 50,000 miles or exceed 6-7 years of tire age when all tires should be replaced.
There is a lot more to this and I would be pleased to answer any PM’s on the subject, but here is Howard post concerning this issue:
http://rv-dreams.typepad.com/rvdreams_journal/2008/10/tires-wheels-financials---pagosa-springs-co.html
There are some links in this post. I recommend you look at them as well. The bottom line is, while important in some ways, all the tire monitor systems will do is tell you there is a leak in so many words - or a change in pressure. They will not prevent a sidewall tire failure such as you indicate you may have had. So, like I have advised my RV friends, this is expensive, and well worth it IF you travel. If the trailer just sits most of the time, maybe not as much expense wise - although "I" would still do it.
BTW, some will tell you the tire is too “heavy” and the trailer will not ride well. They are wrong. That’s why you inflate them properly based on weight.
Finally, be careful about some “J” tires. They also have a lower speed limit when you inflate them below 125PSI. But they cost less - wonder why.
Probably said too much, but I have seen what these tires can do on roads you probably have only seen on “Ice Road Truckers.” My “H” tires didn’t have issues on those roads, others – not so good. So I am just trying to keep people from having issues and maybe a lot of damage to their rig.
Happy to provide more info but maybe Howard will take it from here. He “does” tires now.
Safe Travels
Bill
Edit to activate link
-- Edited by Bill and Linda on Tuesday 16th of October 2012 06:21:04 PM
-- Edited by Bill and Linda on Tuesday 16th of October 2012 09:32:33 PM
Can't thank you enough. We'll look into it. Sure looked like a tire failure to me but we'll see when we get home.
We will definitely look into higher grade tires.
~sherry
Ps AAA RV Plus was great service, whew!
Can you explain the "G114 H Tires" better, please?
Thanks,
~Sherry
Life is always beautiful and it always happens to the other guy..............until its your turn!!!............Be prepared, it wont hurt so much!!
The reference provided below is from Bridgestone. However, it is the best document found on the internet explaining just how “plus sizing” tire procedures are applied. Even though it is not addressing trailer tires in particular, the procedures apply because all of the industry standards and DOT regulations are being followed.
Plus sizing starts on page 15. Use all information that applies to the situation at hand. Appendixes A-2, A-3 and A-4 apply.
http://www.tiresafety.com/images/Tire%20Replacement%20Manual.pdf
FastEagle
Edit by moderator: Activated link. Terry
-- Edited by Terry and Jo on Wednesday 17th of October 2012 10:24:43 AM
I have. Many people have had lots of trouble with “G” tires. It is not a “bad batch,” IMO, and it is not just "Goodyear." It is the tire, again, IMO.
For $460 you would be closer than you think to the cost of an “H” tire and an Aluminum High-Spec Wheel at least last fall when I purchase 4 new ones after 45,000 miles. They were not ready to be replaced at 45,000 miles. I just did because of other factors not related to the "H" tire.
OK here goes, you asked: Try Trailer Tire and Wheel - (419) 272-2277 Ask for Scott – tell him what you are replacing and you want G114 “H” tires and wheels for same. He knows his stuff and may ask a couple of questions to make sure of fit, etc. FWIW, I have ordered via phone and received exactly what I asked for. I have also been physically to his shop. Nice people and fair pricing. However, these tires ARE expensive.
www.trailertiresandwheels.com
This is where Howard, Jack, I and others have acquired “H” tires, on new High Spec wheels, mounted balanced and ready to install via UPS.
They ship UPS and so far no one who I know of who has dealt with Scott has been disappointed.
Hope this helps with your decision as to what to do next.
Good luck
Bill
~Sherry
While this thread is running and weight by axle end has been mentioned I’m going to use that open door to present another point of view on that subject.
Toyo sells a lot of tires to the motorized RV community. Their take on DOT regulations leads me to believe they have an active legal department.
Here is the reference. If you should be using some of their RV tires this reference is required reading.
http://cache.toyotires.com/sites/default/files/RV_tire_safety.pdf
FastEagle
While this thread is running and weight by axle end has been mentioned I’m going to use that open door to present another point of view on that subject.
Toyo sells a lot of tires to the motorized RV community. Their take on DOT regulations leads me to believe they have an active legal department.
Here is the reference. If you should be using some of their RV tires this reference is required reading.
http://cache.toyotires.com/sites/default/files/RV_tire_safety.pdf
FastEagle
Edit by moderator: Activated link. Terry
-- Edited by Terry and Jo on Thursday 18th of October 2012 07:04:39 AM
I just reciently completed a blog posting on thr tire conditions you have posted. Here is a link to the post.
http://fasteagletiretalk.blogspot.com/2012/10/tread-separations.html
FastEagle
I paid a little over $3000.00 for 5 tires and wheels (I also replaced the spare tire and wheel). I was very happy with the entire purchase process, and I love the new tires and wheels. I have about 5000 miles on them and they still look brand new.
BTW, you may find that the shipping can be greatly reduced if you can have the tires and wheels shipped to a business address, (say, a trusted mechanic). That cut my shipping charge significantly.
In the FWIW perspective department as pertains to cost / budget – If it were me and I was purchasing “H” to replace “G”, unless the spare is very old, I wouldn’t necessarily replace the spare “G” tire.
I know this can be discussed both ways and neither is totally right or wrong. If you have the budget for 5, then by all means get 5 new tires and wheels. But IMO if the budget didn’t allow for 5 tires and wheels, but could swing 4, then get upgraded tires and wheels and forgo the upgraded spare until the budget can afford it.
You can put a “G” tire on an axle with an “H” on the other axle. They physically clear. Not an issue. (I have physically checked to make sure as well as reading the specifications for both the tire and wheel diameters.)
My perspective – FWIW
Bill
~Sherry
I would replace all G614 “G” tires with G114 “H” tires. As I have said, G114 tires and wheels are expensive, but unlike the G614 tires they won’t blow due to weak side walls. (“G” replacing “E” tires is another discussion.)
You can’t put G114 tires on your present wheels assuming you have G614 tires now. The wheels must be replaced along with the tires.
The problem with the “G” tires is the side wall. They meet the static specifications but not the dynamic issues when rolling and under load. Anyone ever seen a tire blow out sitting still? That’s the reason for upgrading to the “H” tires when you have a “big rig” such as yours, IMO.
That’s my opinion as requested and what I and Howard did among others. It is worth the money and the additional safety – specifications from the manufacture or DOT aside.
My 2 cents
Bill
Better late than never.
I enjoy the wildlife pictures in your blog. I've added it to the reading list in my blog.
Once a tire of any design is used on the RV trailer axle it becomes a trailer tire and must conform to the fitment regulations for those axles. The GY G614 is basically a hybrid ST tire skinned as an LT.
The overwhelming majority of tread separations are caused by excessive heat build-up. A tire forensic expert can tell you in a flash if a tread separation was caused by a defect or misuse.
One of the things most often avoided in trailer tire discussions is how fast tires used in that position will degrade. One of the most prolific manufacturers of ST tires is on record as saying that ST tires in normal use will lose one third of their strength in three years. RV trailer manufacturers are not very good about providing much - if any - load capacity reserves with their tire selections. So, people in that situation, loading their trailers right up close to the maximum cargo capacity may be operating on overloaded tires within a year.
A little food while I'm at it. Trailer brakes are not very reliable. Connected up to a controller that is not very reliable may compound into a problem that is not easily detectable. Heated brake assemblies will dissipate that heat into the rims and then the tires. Doing a rest area walk around upon arrival may not reveal a hot brake situation. We normally stay in rest areas 15 - 20 minutes on normal stops. We walk to the facilities just to help get the juices flowing. Just before leaving is when I do my walk around. A hot brake situation will be detectable in tire heat by then.
FastEagle
I realize this is an old thread, but since it has been brought back "up"......
If you have a heavy trailer then I would also recommend going to the G114 tires and upgrade the wheels. It is money well worth spending if you live your life on the road.
Personally, I would NEVER put on a G614 tire. I have seen far too many issues with them. Especially if you are anywhere near the upper 25% of their rating. JMO. But based on long, hard experience and research.
-- Edited by Jack Mayer on Thursday 31st of January 2013 10:08:01 AM