I forgot to ask a question in my previous post. The truck I have now is a Ford F350 with the tow package built in. Also it has an electric brake control in it. If it has tow control why does it need a brake control? Any info will be appreciated.
Thanks,
Mike
Terry and Jo said
12:58 AM Mar 23, 2012
You didn't say what year your truck is, but if it has the Intergrated Brake Control built in with the controls in the console somewhere, it should work fine. The biggest issue I have seen with the Ford IBC's is when one has a coach with electric over hydraulic brakes. If yours doesn't have the electric over hydraulic, you shouldn't have any problem. Just be sure and check it out good.
Terry
Terry and Jo said
11:07 AM Mar 23, 2012
Mike,
To give a bit of perspective on what some of us with Fords have, I am including two links to photos of the Intergrated Brake Control controls in our 2008 Ford F450.
The first one is of the full center console area. Look near the bottom for 4 switches in line to the right. Just to the left of those four switches is the control for me to use when applying the trailer brakes only. Just to the left of that "squeeze" controll are indicators for settings on the controller.
Now, if our truck is older, you may not have these controls at all. Also, the references so far in thiis thread to the Carlisle HBA-CAM is only relative to those with Carlisle braking systems on their trailers. In our case, because the Ford IBC system won't work with electric over hydraulic, DRV Suites went to the Carlisle system and we add the Carlisle HBA-CAM to make it work without errors.
Terry
Edit: Added the part about Carlisle braking system.
-- Edited by Terry and Jo on Friday 23rd of March 2012 11:11:09 AM
Bill and Linda said
04:34 PM Mar 23, 2012
To broaden the discussion just a bit:All of the factory truck intergraded brake controllers (IBC’s) can have issues with electric over hydraulic brake systems.(If you have disc brakes you have an electric over hydraulic controller in the trailer.)The problem is normally related to the controllers in the trucks which may, or may not, play nice with the electric hydraulic controllers in the trailers regardless of the brand of the truck.As always – it depends and has to do with sensing and "hand shaking" between the two systems to put it simply.
My Dexter controller in the trailer does “seem” to work OK with the factory truck controller which is not specifically designed to work with electric over hydraulic brakes.Other trailer controllers, such as those found in some Mobile Suites, don’t work well (or for long) with the IBC that comes from the factory without an adapter in the trailer.(Those are Carlisle as last know to me.)
The point is – it depends - and I personally recommend installing an aftermarket controller (I prefer the P2) that is specially designed to communicate properly with the trailer's electric over hydraulic brake controllers.IMO, none of the factory IBC’s, even if they work, are as precise or offer the adjustment flexibility of these aftermarket controllers.I put another P2 on my new truck even though the factory IBC would work.The aftermarket just works much better (including being able to turn off braking in reverse) than the factory IBC’s.
That’s just my opinion, but it’s based on a lot of towing miles, through a lot of very difficult conditions over the past five years and not just a couple of moves a year.
My 2 cents should it be helpful
Bill
Edited to correct html error
-- Edited by Bill and Linda on Friday 23rd of March 2012 04:39:44 PM
igotjam said
05:08 PM Mar 23, 2012
Terry is correct. On my 08 Ford page 223 of the owners manual talks about the built in controller not being able to run electric/hydraulic brakes. I spent a bunch of time at Ford dealers and trailer places trying to make it work before giving up and installing an aftermarket controller. (Terry the Carlisle HBA-Cam would not help with my trailer brake actuator)
53 Merc said
05:34 PM Mar 23, 2012
mward3 wrote:
I forgot to ask a question in my previous post. The truck I have now is a Ford F350 with the tow package built in. Also it has an electric brake control in it. If it has tow control why does it need a brake control? Any info will be appreciated.
Thanks,
Mike
Well, you forgot that this bunch (me included) are detail oriented. First, what model year is your truck (it does make a difference). Second, you say it has a tow package, and that also means something different based on year model. Tow package prior to about 2007 means it has added cooling, larger brakes and wiring to the back of the truck already installed to operate trailer brakes and lights. After about 2007 if ordered, means it has an integrated braking system operated by the foot brake. It also has all the aforementioned physical enhancements. Then you call it tow control, which is what I think you really meant in the first place. Tow control operates the brakes, provides additional settings so you can fine tune the braking of the trailer to suit your driving style or level of comfort.
Lastly, the brake control is added so you can manually operate the trailer brakes at your convenience without engaging the truck brakes. I use the brake controller to do a pre-leaving test I call a pull test. I raise the fifth wheel landing gear about an inch of the ground with all systems hooked up and ready to leave (tailgate down). I start the truck and put it in gear with the truck brakes engaged. Then I manually operate the brake controller to max,, release the foot brake and do my best to drive off. If the trailer brakes are set correctly and the hitch is latched properly, I can't move, ensuring the trailer will not come detached and crease the pickup bed side rails and damage the trailer. After satisfying my latchup, I close the tailgate, raise the landing gear to normal travel position, and go on my way.
Enjoy the trailering experience and remember, it is all about having fun.
Jim Dean said
05:37 PM Mar 23, 2012
I also have an 08 Ford. Camping World in New Braunfels Tx installed a magnet with two wires coming out of it and it fixed my problem. I have a Carlisle brake controller and my Ford would not communicate with it. I had tried two of the Carlisle HBA cams and both burned up within a few miles. The magnet device was around $20. Installation took about 10 minutes.
mward3 said
10:31 PM Mar 23, 2012
Sorry for the lack of details. It is a 2006 F350 Super Duty Dually (bought used). I think you answered my question 53 Merc. What I was trying to find out is if my truck is equiped with the built in electric brake controls on the dash which it has, why would they install a second electric brake system under the dash, which it also has. My main concern was that the one on the dash may not work properly and I should have it checked out. I will at least try your test before towing.
I forgot to ask a question in my previous post. The truck I have now is a Ford F350 with the tow package built in. Also it has an electric brake control in it. If it has tow control why does it need a brake control? Any info will be appreciated.
Thanks,
Mike
You didn't say what year your truck is, but if it has the Intergrated Brake Control built in with the controls in the console somewhere, it should work fine. The biggest issue I have seen with the Ford IBC's is when one has a coach with electric over hydraulic brakes. If yours doesn't have the electric over hydraulic, you shouldn't have any problem. Just be sure and check it out good.
Terry
Mike,
To give a bit of perspective on what some of us with Fords have, I am including two links to photos of the Intergrated Brake Control controls in our 2008 Ford F450.
The first one is of the full center console area. Look near the bottom for 4 switches in line to the right. Just to the left of those four switches is the control for me to use when applying the trailer brakes only. Just to the left of that "squeeze" controll are indicators for settings on the controller.
Full center console area
This second picture is a close-up of the brake controller "squeeze" control with a glimpse of the display area to the left of it.
Close-up of controls
Now, if our truck is older, you may not have these controls at all. Also, the references so far in thiis thread to the Carlisle HBA-CAM is only relative to those with Carlisle braking systems on their trailers. In our case, because the Ford IBC system won't work with electric over hydraulic, DRV Suites went to the Carlisle system and we add the Carlisle HBA-CAM to make it work without errors.
Terry
Edit: Added the part about Carlisle braking system.
-- Edited by Terry and Jo on Friday 23rd of March 2012 11:11:09 AM
To broaden the discussion just a bit: All of the factory truck intergraded brake controllers (IBC’s) can have issues with electric over hydraulic brake systems. (If you have disc brakes you have an electric over hydraulic controller in the trailer.) The problem is normally related to the controllers in the trucks which may, or may not, play nice with the electric hydraulic controllers in the trailers regardless of the brand of the truck. As always – it depends and has to do with sensing and "hand shaking" between the two systems to put it simply.
My Dexter controller in the trailer does “seem” to work OK with the factory truck controller which is not specifically designed to work with electric over hydraulic brakes. Other trailer controllers, such as those found in some Mobile Suites, don’t work well (or for long) with the IBC that comes from the factory without an adapter in the trailer. (Those are Carlisle as last know to me.)
The point is – it depends - and I personally recommend installing an aftermarket controller (I prefer the P2) that is specially designed to communicate properly with the trailer's electric over hydraulic brake controllers. IMO, none of the factory IBC’s, even if they work, are as precise or offer the adjustment flexibility of these aftermarket controllers. I put another P2 on my new truck even though the factory IBC would work. The aftermarket just works much better (including being able to turn off braking in reverse) than the factory IBC’s.
That’s just my opinion, but it’s based on a lot of towing miles, through a lot of very difficult conditions over the past five years and not just a couple of moves a year.
My 2 cents should it be helpful
Bill
Edited to correct html error
-- Edited by Bill and Linda on Friday 23rd of March 2012 04:39:44 PM
Well, you forgot that this bunch (me included) are detail oriented. First, what model year is your truck (it does make a difference). Second, you say it has a tow package, and that also means something different based on year model. Tow package prior to about 2007 means it has added cooling, larger brakes and wiring to the back of the truck already installed to operate trailer brakes and lights. After about 2007 if ordered, means it has an integrated braking system operated by the foot brake. It also has all the aforementioned physical enhancements. Then you call it tow control, which is what I think you really meant in the first place. Tow control operates the brakes, provides additional settings so you can fine tune the braking of the trailer to suit your driving style or level of comfort.
Lastly, the brake control is added so you can manually operate the trailer brakes at your convenience without engaging the truck brakes. I use the brake controller to do a pre-leaving test I call a pull test. I raise the fifth wheel landing gear about an inch of the ground with all systems hooked up and ready to leave (tailgate down). I start the truck and put it in gear with the truck brakes engaged. Then I manually operate the brake controller to max,, release the foot brake and do my best to drive off. If the trailer brakes are set correctly and the hitch is latched properly, I can't move, ensuring the trailer will not come detached and crease the pickup bed side rails and damage the trailer. After satisfying my latchup, I close the tailgate, raise the landing gear to normal travel position, and go on my way.
Enjoy the trailering experience and remember, it is all about having fun.
The magnet device was around $20. Installation took about 10 minutes.
Sorry for the lack of details. It is a 2006 F350 Super Duty Dually (bought used). I think you answered my question 53 Merc. What I was trying to find out is if my truck is equiped with the built in electric brake controls on the dash which it has, why would they install a second electric brake system under the dash, which it also has. My main concern was that the one on the dash may not work properly and I should have it checked out. I will at least try your test before towing.
Thanks for the info.
Mike