I've done a bit of research on this and haven't found out that there's an obvious right answer.
Connie and I will be going full time next summer. We're currently residents of VA and she will probably continue to work remotely for one of the colleges here so we'll owe VA state income tax on her pay. The general idea of most full timers is to get into a no income tax state. Other than her VA part time check . . .we've got my Navy retirement, her pension from the ACP headquartered in PA, and investment income. We would also like a state where no special drivers license is needed . . .we'll have a 5ver and either a F450 or an HDT tow vehicle.
The typical states you see recommended are FL, TX, or SD . . .I see on another thread that SD is pretty easy to handle, a user on that thread started in TX and moved. TX has special license requirements, SD and FL do not.
I realize that individual circumstances mean that everybody's case is different . . .but I hate to reinvent the wheel if it's already been done. We could just stay VA residents (they don't have any special license issues) . . .our son lives in Richmond so we'll have a mailing address . . .but we hate to pay a couple thousand bucks a year to VA when we don't live here. OTOH, it's a lot easier than changing at the beginning and we can always re-domicile in another state later. We won't be staying put in any location long enough to get legally classified as a resident . . .we're going to be nomads like Howard and Linda although will probably spend 2-3 months in the winter in someplace warm like FL, TX, or Palm Springs.
Has this problem already been solved?
neil
Terry and Jo said
05:43 PM Dec 17, 2011
Neil,
Short answer would be, "No, it hasn't been fully answered." The reason is that in addition to states that don't charge income tax, some may charge high personal property tax, which would almost negate the option of choosing those states.
Also, some states will be tax-free on some form of pensions. But, they might have other issues that negate the option of choosing those states.
This topic has been discussed quite a bit. I'm sure that others will give you a lot better answer than I have because Jo and I are still working. Should they be slow in answering, use the search function of the forums. I'll also try to look around and provide you some links to more information.
Terry
Bill Adams said
09:01 PM Dec 17, 2011
I know you want get the heck away from VA unless they have changed their personal property rates or you have a very, very old RV. I think it was around 5% of the RV value which can take a might chunk of change each year. We are FL residents and my RV tags cost $73.60 for this upcoming year. If you have owned the RV for more than 6 months and have had it registered in another State there are no additional charges. New RV purchases require that you pay the State sales tax. FL also has no personal income tax so if I ever get a pay check again this will be a large benefit as well. While not the best health insurance rates, FL rates are much better than TX rates. I suspect that SD is better than both.
DorisandDave said
02:08 AM Dec 18, 2011
We chose SD. Let's see....No income tax, no property tax, no tax on military pensions. We did all our vehicle licensing through the mail with our mail service. You do have to GO to SD to get a driver's license, but only need to stay overnight and must do it, I think, within 90 days of registering your vehicles. I'm not sure about a special license for HDT, but you don't need one with an F450 pulling a 5th wheel.
We purchased a new 5th wheel and saved over $3000 by registering it in SD. Kansas has high personal property tax. They don't have a personal property tax per se, but do charge an "excise fee" the first time you register a new vehicle. It was still cheaper than the taxes we paid in KS. Don't pay it in the following years. In KS to register our Truck, car, motorcycles and old 5er it was well over 1200 a year. In SD renewal for Truck and 5er was less than $200 and I think even less than that. I'd have to go look.
Since you have Navy retirement I assume you have Tricare so health insurance shouldn't be an issue. Vehicle insurance was very reasonable.
I'll bet someone will chime in with TX info.
Doris
GiniaJ said
06:44 AM Dec 18, 2011
Don't register in TX. We have been residents for years now and it is not cheap. Can't give figures now but have heard better things about SD and FL. I know my health insurance rates in TX through AARP (in addition to my medicare, I have secondary insurance) are close to $300 per month. We moved temporarily to NM a while back (thought it might be permanent) so I changed my insurance to that state and it dropped $200 dollars! I've left it in NM and have to figure out a new place to call home so I can get a permanent address. I simply never changed the address back to TX. As we do not live there any longer but still use our old home address (son is renting there now) until we decide what to do, TX it is for now. The only benefit to TX is no state income tax. Otherwise, nothing that I can see.
53 Merc said
08:21 AM Dec 18, 2011
A previous poster said don't register in TX. The reasoning was that insurance was more expensive. Might be true for her area, but if you are careful when you select the location (county of residence) it might change. Harris county and the 7 surrounding, as well as Dallas and 5 surrounding are higher than a cat's back. Stick with rural areas and the selection might make sense. Also, check with an insurance agent on rates. Stay away from AARP (IMHO), get an agent that you think you can trust based on personal contact and they can suggest many ways to save money on insurance. We have a homebase in a rural location near Lubbock, TX and our health insurance rates, vehicle insurance rates are pretty low. Moving from near San Antonio saved us a heap of money.
Howard said
08:43 AM Dec 18, 2011
Yes, SD, TX, & FL are the most popular states for full-timers mainly because 1) they are no income tax states (and retirement income is not taxed), 2) there is no personal property tax on vehicle values, 3) there is no estate or inheritance tax, and 4) they have great mail forwarding services that make it easy to establish residency.
Yes, a special class of drivers license is needed for Texas (won't get into the requirements for that here).
Alaska, Wyoming, Washington, and Nevada are also "no income tax" states and have similar benefits to the top three - they just aren't as popular. For some, depending on individual situations, they may be better.
Tennessee and New Hampshire are also "no income tax" states in that they don't tax "earned income", but they do tax dividends and interest which can be an issue for those relying on that type of income.
Those that haven't purchased their rigs before establishing a full-timing residence may want to consider establishing residence in a "no sales tax" state first (Montana, Oregon, Delaware, New Hampshire, Alaska). They may be able to buy the RV and other vehicles without sales tax and then transfer to a "no income tax" state later (although they could still be hit with a "sales-type" tax if they try to transfer vehicles to another state too soon). ALSO, Montana, Oregon, and Delaware have income taxes and tax retirement income to some extent, so any sales tax savings may be offset by income tax depending on how the numbers work out. Montana also has a personal property tax on vehicles.
New Hampshire, as a "no income tax" and "no sales tax" state, taxes only "interest and dividends" so it may be a winner for those buying an RV and that don't have much income from those sources.
Alaska can be a great choice, but there are pros and cons, and the act of establishing residence there is simply not very convenient. With that said, if I were already a resident of Alaska, I certainly wouldn't change.
So, "the best state" depends on individual circumstances, and it's very, very important that each person do the homework for their own personal situation. Income levels, sources of income, convenience, taxes (income, sales, personal property), insurance costs and coverages, voting, license renewals, vehicle registration costs and renewals, and much more play a part in the decision. And "yes", it's not just particular states, but counties and zip codes within the states make a difference.
You will certainly want a state with no income tax, but I just want to caution others reading this thread that may not be the case in their situation.
-- Edited by Howard on Friday 30th of December 2011 10:40:10 PM
melandu said
02:36 PM Dec 18, 2011
Hey,
I've lived in Texas all my life and I'm full timing now with a mailing address in Texas. I have a question????? I don't have a motorhome, we have a 38ft. fiver, but I have never heard of needing a special drivers license for a motorhome. Can someone tell me about this special license you need????
Mel
2008 Carri-Lite Emerald 2011 F350 Ford Diesel
Trabuco said
02:44 PM Dec 18, 2011
Mel - Don't know about Texas but in California any MH over 40 feet in length requires a special drivers license. It entails a written test and driving test.
rclvnv said
03:04 PM Dec 18, 2011
I lived in Nevada prior to full-timing,and our consulting business has been long based there,so we simply chose to remain Nevada residents,as there is no income tax. We use a UPS Store to recieve and fwd our mail.However DMV fees and vehicle insurance rates can be high,based on age of vehicles,and where you domicile in the state. For example,Nye county,just 50 miles west of Las Vegas (Clark County),has much much lower insurance rates,a lower sales tax rate, lower registration rates,and no smog requirement. Not surprisingly,the mailbox stores in Pahrump (Nye County) do a big business in box rentals,as Nevada Residency can be extablished this way.If one lived in CA,for example, it might be far more convenient to try to establish Nevada residency,due to distance factors.From what I read here,however,vehicle registration fees, and insurance are likely to be less in SD,& Fla.
Richard
53 Merc said
03:15 PM Dec 18, 2011
melandu wrote:
Hey,
I've lived in Texas all my life and I'm full timing now with a mailing address in Texas. I have a question????? I don't have a motorhome, we have a 38ft. fiver, but I have never heard of needing a special drivers license for a motorhome. Can someone tell me about this special license you need????
Mel
2008 Carri-Lite Emerald 2011 F350 Ford Diesel
Something in the back of my mind tells me it is about weight. 26,001 lbs or more GVW is the number I remember, for a Class A license. You can go to http://www.txdps.state.tx.us/DriverLicense/documents/DL-7.pdf and try to decipher the regulation. Remember, it is the gubmint talking and far be it from them to make anything simple.
Bill and Linda said
04:18 PM Dec 18, 2011
53 Merc wrote:
melandu wrote:
Hey,
I've lived in Texas all my life and I'm full timing now with a mailing address in Texas. I have a question????? I don't have a motorhome, we have a 38ft. fiver, but I have never heard of needing a special drivers license for a motorhome. Can someone tell me about this special license you need????
Mel
2008 Carri-Lite Emerald 2011 F350 Ford Diesel
Something in the back of my mind tells me it is about weight. 26,001 lbs or more GVW is the number I remember, for a Class A license. You can go to http://www.txdps.state.tx.us/DriverLicense/documents/DL-7.pdf and try to decipher the regulation. Remember, it is the gubmint talking and far be it from them to make anything simple.
Yep, Texas is the same as my state – You need a Class A or B (NON-CDL) for the RV if:
1. Class A driver license permits a person to drive any vehicle or combination
of vehicles with a gross combination weight rating of 26,001 pounds or
more, provided the gross vehicle weight rating of the vehicle(s) being towed
is in excess of 10,000 pounds; including
2. Class B driver license permits a person to drive the following vehicles,
except a motorcycle or moped:
a. a single unit vehicle with a gross vehicle weight rating of 26,001
pounds or more, and any such vehicle towing either a vehicle with a
gross vehicle weight rating that does not exceed 10,000 pounds, or a
farm trailer with a gross vehicle weight rating that does not exceed
20,000 pounds;
These are cut and paste from Chapter 1 of the Texas DL handbook.
These are the same for my state and if my 5er and truck have a CGWR of 26,001 lbs or more and the trailer is greater than 10,001 lbs I need a Class A (NON-CDL) license.
If the motor home has a GVWR of 26,001 lbs or more I need a Class B (or Class A) license.
Each state is different and your state of residency that issues the license determines what you need, not where you live or where you “are.”
Check it out. Your state laws may be very similar or perhaps more complicated.It depends. The lawyers can comment, but driving with the wrong "Class" of license is the same as driving without a license according to my legal advice.
Bill
melandu said
08:22 PM Dec 18, 2011
Thanks Bill for the info. I really didn't realize you had to have a special license. Like I said I don't have a motorhome, but I do have a few friends that do drive a motorhome and I will be sure and tell them about this law. It would hurt them on their insurance if they didn't have this license, so thanks again for let me know.
Mel
Neil and Connie said
07:39 PM Dec 19, 2011
Thanks all for your suggestions and comments . . .I think we'll likely go with either FL or SD with TX a distant third due to the licensing requirements. That was pretty much what I had figured out already . . .but wanted to make sure I hadn't failed to take something into account.
mrschwarz said
07:02 AM Dec 23, 2011
If your trailer has a GVW or more than 10000 pounds, you need a class A license.
Bill and Linda said
08:13 AM Dec 23, 2011
mrschwarz wrote:
If your trailer has a GVW or more than 10000 pounds, you need a class A license.
Hi Michael:
What State are you referring to, Texas?‘Just trying to clarify as it doesn’t say that in the Texas DL manual as cut and pasted above.It says a 10,000lb trailer and 26,001lbs combined weight.Perhaps you have other documentation as a Texas resident.
Nonetheless everyone should check their state of residency laws as that is the determining factor.In fact, I rechecked my state and since I got my Class A many years ago they changed the rules.At one time my state did require a Class A if the trailer was over 10,001 lbs regardless of the Combined Vehicle Weight. (Even said so on the licenses.) Now the rule reads just like Texas and other states. That is, the determining factor is a 10,001lb trailer and 26,001lb GCVW.
I suspect my state decided to get into compliance with the other states for reasons I won’t get into.But nonetheless the law changed in 2009 so most lighter weight 5ers don’t need a Class A here, only a Class C.It depends.
All that said to say, please check your individual state’s rules and don’t get caught if the DL clerk says “You don’t need a CDL to drive an RV.”True in most cases, but it depends on the state and size of the rig – two or three exceptions.. But as most know, a Class A is not a CDL. This is widely misunderstood by some and bears personal investigation and understanding
Actually I wish Howard would do a complete website section on this as it is just as important as insurance.Driving with the wrong class of license is the same as not having a license if you have an accident.
Please, don’t take this site as total authority, but it is a good place to start and has links to the state DMV sites where you can sometimes get the manual.
-- Edited by Bill and Linda on Friday 23rd of December 2011 05:02:38 PM
Alie and Jims Carrilite said
08:52 AM Dec 23, 2011
In NC, you do not need a Class A non-CDL for RV's less than 26000 GCWR BUT we do have weighted tags here, meaning that your truck license plate has to be paid for the total weight of your vehicle plus the max weight that you might be towing. It gets confusing here. I use my private truck to pull my business owned 18k boat trailer that has disc brakes. The 18k trailer plus my 8000 pound truck put me into CDL territory. But as long as I don't actually weigh that much I'm fine without the CDL. If the boat trailers were privately owned then I would have to have a Class A non-CDL. What aggravates me is that most insurance companies raise rates for class A licenses, and more for CDL.
TXRVr said
01:36 PM Dec 23, 2011
laubenthal wrote:
1. she will probably continue to work remotely for one of the colleges here....
2. we've got my Navy retirement..
3- TX has special license requirements, SD and FL do not.
1- There are a lot of colleges in Texas. Just about one on every street corner.
2- Texas is one of the most military friendly states in the entire US. There are 15 installations here with campgrounds at them or a MWR supported CG somewhere nearby. I estimate that there are 30-40 Veteran's health care facilities all over the state.
3- With a 5W, you will not need anything but a regular DL.
Texas is big enough to handle lots of snowbirds without being elbow to elbow. However, please be advised that there are two hangin' offenses for visitors. One is for Yankees to tell us how to do things and the other is wearing black socks with shorts.
Neil and Connie said
04:45 PM Dec 23, 2011
TXRVr wrote:
1- There are a lot of colleges in Texas. Just about one on every street corner.
2- Texas is one of the most military friendly states in the entire US. There are 15 installations here with campgrounds at them or a MWR supported CG somewhere nearby. I estimate that there are 30-40 Veteran's health care facilities all over the state.
3- With a 5W, you will not need anything but a regular DL.
Texas is big enough to handle lots of snowbirds without being elbow to elbow. However, please be advised that there are two hangin' offenses for visitors. One is for Yankees to tell us how to do things and the other is wearing black socks with shorts.
True . . .lots of colleges there but she doens't really want to work per se . . .and what she's doing can all be done without going to the office so she doesn't look it as work. Besides; she likes it so who am I to argue.
Lots of military installations there . . .you got that right; but reading other posts in the thread and looking at changingears.com says that >26,000 GVWR or trailer > 10,000 requires the non commercial A or B license. The 450 is about 9,000 and the DRV or New Horizons we're looking at is 19,000 or 21,000 loaded so that gets both >26K and 10K tow.
Black socks with shorts . . .I take it that my short black biking socks are OK? Gotta wear something with the sneakers or else they get too gamey I got white ones too . . .but figure if Lance Armstrong can get away with black then I can too.
If we were settling down permanently . . .Texas is where we'll go to; but I'm not convinced that for an RVer the hassle of needing the special license is worth it. I will have to see what the registration costs are here in VA . . .we'll be keeping a mailing address at our son's down in Richmond so staying VA residents at least for the remainder of 2012 is an option . . .otherwise we'll make a decision after considering sales tax, income tax, and insurance costs and change residency before we buy the RV.
Steve C said
08:44 PM Dec 27, 2011
After a fair amount of research, we changed our residence from NC to SD. In addition to no income tax and personal property tax, our RV (2012 DRV 38RESB3 Elite Suite) and truck (2012 Chevy 3500 HD) insurance was about half of what it would have been in NC. Our vehicles tags were also much less. Got our insurance through Dougherty Insurance (866-725-5643) in Sioux Falls.
Our mail service is "Your Best Address" (800-419-1690). Larry and Tina were very, very helpful. We did go spend two nights in Sioux Falls and really enjoyed our time there. It is a very nice city. Got our SD drivers license. You will need a motel or campground receipt with BOTH names on the receipt. If you use Larry's service please tell him that I told you about them.
You can see SD photos on our blog: http://puppypaths.blogspot.com.
Send me an email on this site if I can answer any questions for you about DRV as this is our second 5th wheel from them. Jack Mayer is a good contact for New Horizon.
Good luck,
Steve
mrschwarz said
02:24 PM Jan 1, 2012
Bill and Linda wrote:
mrschwarz wrote:
If your trailer has a GVW or more than 10000 pounds, you need a class A license.
Hi Michael:
What State are you referring to, Texas?‘Just trying to clarify as it doesn’t say that in the Texas DL manual as cut and pasted above.It says a 10,000lb trailer and 26,001lbs combined weight.Perhaps you have other documentation as a Texas resident.
-- Edited by Bill and Linda on Friday 23rd of December 2011 05:02:38 PM
I don't have any special information, just the inate ability to misread the rules. :) I do have first hand experience with the 26,000 limit though.
53 Merc said
04:19 PM Jan 1, 2012
TXRVr wrote:
1- There are a lot of colleges in Texas. Just about one on every street corner.
2- Texas is one of the most military friendly states in the entire US. There are 15 installations here with campgrounds at them or a MWR supported CG somewhere nearby. I estimate that there are 30-40 Veteran's health care facilities all over the state.
3- With a 5W, you will not need anything but a regular DL.
Texas is big enough to handle lots of snowbirds without being elbow to elbow. However, please be advised that there are two hangin' offenses for visitors. One is for Yankees to tell us how to do things and the other is wearing black socks with shorts.
TXRVr, is now the time to remind "Yankees" of the difference between Yankees and Damyankees? You know, Yankees are still up north, damyankees are down here telling us what is wrong with us and saying WE are the ones with an accent :)
Terry and Jo said
06:57 PM Jan 1, 2012
53 Merc wrote:
TXRVr wrote:
1- There are a lot of colleges in Texas. Just about one on every street corner.
2- Texas is one of the most military friendly states in the entire US. There are 15 installations here with campgrounds at them or a MWR supported CG somewhere nearby. I estimate that there are 30-40 Veteran's health care facilities all over the state.
3- With a 5W, you will not need anything but a regular DL.
Texas is big enough to handle lots of snowbirds without being elbow to elbow. However, please be advised that there are two hangin' offenses for visitors. One is for Yankees to tell us how to do things and the other is wearing black socks with shorts.
TXRVr, is now the time to remind "Yankees" of the difference between Yankees and Damyankees? You know, Yankees are still up north, damyankees are down here telling us what is wrong with us and saying WE are the ones with an accent :)
Yeah, well don't forget us Okies up here that are ready to "whoop-up" on the Yankees of every form, as well as the Texans. (Come to think of it, I think Oklahoma and Texas need to form their own country.)
Terry
53 Merc said
08:04 PM Jan 1, 2012
Will we require "them" to have a passport to come in and limit their stay? Well, Okies might need a leash.
heyjohnm said
09:14 AM Jan 3, 2012
....well everyone should have a leash... (as long as there is a dog at one end)
klipsch49er said
09:58 PM Jan 16, 2012
Looks like this thread has slid off the road a bit related to the topic, but being a noob here I shouldn't say anything.... LOL!
Except I really would like to know what sources people have uncovered to get the information to make a decision about what state to set up in. Is there a tabulation anywhere? It's not that I don't trust everything I have read in this forum but I learned a lesson earlier in life related to important information: "Trust but verify".
We have just gone through a nightmare related to changing tow vehicles. We still have a residence in CA. but are nearly full timers. Our truck failed in TN and we traded it in at a dealer in Nashville. Getting the title from CA for the trade in and figuting out how to get a plate for the new TN truck when we live in CA was a rediculous exercise which we hope does not come back to bite us in the runp later (the truck now has a KY plate thanks to our daughters address in KY). Now we are on the road with a KY truck, a CA 5th, and CA DL.
We want to get all of our eggs in one basket before we goof something up.
Thanks in advance!
Go 49ers!
Jim01 said
06:53 AM Jan 17, 2012
Ed, first of all, welcome to the forum.
That's part of the problem, I don't think that there is any one place where you can get all the information that you need to pick a state.
You need to go to DMV sites, contact insurance companies and do lots of research on things that will make a difference to you.
Our mail forwarding service, Alternative Resources http://www.alternativeresources.net/ out of Sioux Falls, SD was very helpful. They sent us information about taxes and a chart on what it would cost to register our vehicles in SD. Then, after contacting an insurance company, we were finally able to get an idea of what the cost would be.
It's not easy, but doing some research will pay off in the long run.
Oh, and yes, get all those eggs in one basket. It could get very complicated having vehicles registered in more than one state.
Jim
-- Edited by Jim01 on Tuesday 17th of January 2012 06:56:33 AM
Neil and Connie said
09:17 AM Jan 17, 2012
We've decided to use SD . . .a quick search revealed America's Mailbox which is run by an RVer and Alternative Resources. I see that one reply recommended the latter . . .anybody have any experience with America's Mailbox? They're cheaper but sometimes you get what you pay for . . .and in any event it's the western edge of the state instead of eastern . . .so it's a farther drive from DC to get there.
I would guess the best way to proceed is go ahead and get residency/driver license before buying either the truck or the RV . . .assuming that's done can I register both directly in SD or is it a matter of registering in state of purchase (VA for the truck most likely and Kansas for the RV; we're almost surely going with a New Horizons unit) and then reregistering later? I'm pretty sure we can register the RV directly in SD but don't have any idea if one can do that with a new truck.
Neil and Connie said
01:31 PM Jan 18, 2012
Delaine and Lindy wrote:
You might take a look at Tennesee, we have no State income Tax. Tags for my Truck 2012 Chevy 3500HD is $24.50 per year the Freightliner was the same. Tags for the Mobile Suites is $14.50 per year or you can purchase a tag thats for ever for I believe its $88.00 per year. We do have a high sales tax, 9.75%. But all in all its not bad.... Happy Trails....
Will check them again since my sister is a TN resident. . .but I think we already eliminated them due to the sales tax. With a new New Horizons trailer, a new F450, and likely a used late model Jeep the sales tax on the 3 would be way up there. The trailer and truck are north of 200K between them. I suppose we could pay the 3% to VA instead and then reregister in TN after a year . . .I'll have to check again.
--later
Checked and they do have income tax on investment income . . .which means it's a no go for us; it's that investment income that's (partially anyway) allowing us to become fulltimers. Too bad . . .my sister would have liked it better.
-- Edited by laubenthal on Wednesday 18th of January 2012 01:45:29 PM
Jim01 said
03:12 PM Jan 18, 2012
Neil,
Unless something has changed, and I don't think it has, in SD once you contact a Mail forwarding service and get an address, you can do everything else, (except getting a drivers license) by mail.
By mail, we established residency in June and registerd our vehicles without ever being in the state. We finally made it to SD in July to get our drivers licenses.
Since then, we have only been in SD twice. Both times to renew our drivers license.
Jim
Delaine and Lindy said
03:53 PM Jan 18, 2012
You might take a look at Tennesee, we have no State income Tax. Tags for my Truck 2012 Chevy 3500HD is $24.50 per year the Freightliner was the same. Tags for the Mobile Suites is $14.50 per year or you can purchase a tag thats for ever for I believe its $88.00 per year. We do have a high sales tax, 9.75%. But all in all its not bad.... Happy Trails....
Neil and Connie said
09:27 PM Jan 18, 2012
Jim, thanks . . .I've contacted Alternative Resources and America's mailbox and both confirm that a single trip to get driver licenses and register to vote is all we need to . . .both the truck and trailer can be done via email. They charge a small fee for it . . .but it's a lot cheaper than going back.
DorisandDave said
02:08 AM Jan 19, 2012
We use Americas Mailbox and have been quite satisfied with them. We just go online to order mail, either a one time address or a repeating address.
We just did our renewal for our tags and was easy peasy. They sent us a reminder more than a month in advance with the amount we needed to pay. We sent them a money order and instructions where to send them. We received them within 10 days by priority mail.
You can choose from several different plans, change anytime and see everything online.
Neil and Connie said
02:22 AM Jan 19, 2012
DorisandDave wrote:
We use Americas Mailbox and have been quite satisfied with them. We just go online to order mail, either a one time address or a repeating address.
Thanks . . .they are cheaper so I am tempted to go with them but wanted to verify that service was fine before I do so. The only drawback is that when we drive from DC to get license/residency it's 300 miles closer to Alternative Resources in Sioux Falls than to Rapid City. But then we said to ourselves . . .we don't have to actually go to Rapid City if we use Americas Mailbox . . .as long as the mailbox is set up ahead of time we can just drive to the Sioux Falls and do license/vote/residency . . .then do all the rest via mail.
DorisandDave said
10:57 PM Jan 19, 2012
laubenthal wrote:
DorisandDave wrote:
We use Americas Mailbox and have been quite satisfied with them. We just go online to order mail, either a one time address or a repeating address.
Thanks . . .they are cheaper so I am tempted to go with them but wanted to verify that service was fine before I do so. The only drawback is that when we drive from DC to get license/residency it's 300 miles closer to Alternative Resources in Sioux Falls than to Rapid City. But then we said to ourselves . . .we don't have to actually go to Rapid City if we use Americas Mailbox . . .as long as the mailbox is set up ahead of time we can just drive to the Sioux Falls and do license/vote/residency . . .then do all the rest via mail.
Yep! don't have to actually go where your mailbox is, just far enough into the state to get your license. Just be sure and check where you go though, because when we went to Sioux Falls the office there had odd hours and several other cities in the SW of the state are only open 1 day a month.
Neil and Connie said
11:13 PM Jan 19, 2012
DorisandDave wrote:Just be sure and check where you go though, because when we went to Sioux Falls the office there had odd hours and several other cities in the SW of the state are only open 1 day a month.
I saw that on the website for Alternative Resources in Sioux Falls . . .we'll verify that both the DMV and the voting registrar are open. I think that currently the DMV is closed Monday but not the registrar.
Terry and Jo said
03:36 AM Jan 23, 2012
Well, I looked but probably missed reading it, but isn't it true that when registering in South Dakota that one needs to show a receipt for a hotel or motel or something as a requirement?
For some reason, such a stipulation has been mentioned before, but for the life of me I sure can't find it. Those of you registered in SD could sure help out some people in their planning for changing to SD.
Now, for a separate question as to registering one's trucks and fifth wheel in South Dakota, is there a time limit that would prevent one from having to pay the sales taxes for SD if they had already bought their equipment prior to moving? If so, does anyone know that that time limit would be?
Terry
Neil and Connie said
05:16 AM Jan 23, 2012
Terry and Jo wrote:
Well, I looked but probably missed reading it, but isn't it true that when registering in South Dakota that one needs to show a receipt for a hotel or motel or something as a requirement?
The receipt for lodging is for voter registration; but you can still use your mailing address for everything else.
For the time period for registering . . .check on the Mailboxes America and/or Alternative Resources mailbox. One of them either on the web page or maybe in the forms you can download had the details about that I think. I took a quick look but didn't find it.
There is a 3% tax when you register but you get credit for tax paid already to another state. Both of the firms listed have pretty detailed info on their sites.
I think we're going to go with Americas Mailbox . . .they're cheaper. However, instead of driving all the way to the west side of SD we'll go to Sioux City instead . . .it's 600 miles less round trip for us from DC.
Delaine and Lindy said
07:11 PM Jan 23, 2012
Well as for Tennessee investment income being tax. I lost my investment income back in the 2000's I would never invest in the Stock market again. Day traders is destroying the markets. And with our economy, you would do as good at a Casino at least you can control your money.. But I don't gamble. Happy Trails..........
Jack Mayer said
08:39 PM Jan 23, 2012
Delaine and Lindy wrote:
I would never invest in the Stock market again. Day traders is destroying the markets. And with our economy, you would do as good at a Casino at least you can control your money.. But I don't gamble. Happy Trails..........
There are still many reasonable performing investments in the "market" that are relatively safe. But for sure, the market is not for everyone. And you do have to understand your tolerance for risk.
Bill Adams said
11:29 PM Jan 23, 2012
I've been in Casinos and I have been in the Stock Market. I will stick with the Stock Market for long term return on my money!
Delaine and Lindy said
06:46 PM Jan 24, 2012
Many people aren't long term in todays market, many are day traders. I have been into many Casinos and no I don't gamble, I did gamble on the stock market and lost.... In my opinion the stock market is so volatile, just not the stock market of old..... But its a choice and I made mine. I still think Tennessee is a good retirement State... It sure has been for our use... No matter were you retire there will be issues you may like or dislike... My comments are food for though, I'm in no way compensated for my comments. And I'm in no way a expert as some are.... My training when drafted was by professionals in the Combat Arms field, now I for sure can tell you some things in that field. And I was trained well I survived Vietnam and 26 years and 22 days of active duty... But I'm a novice in the field of RVing. Happy Trails..........
I've done a bit of research on this and haven't found out that there's an obvious right answer.
Connie and I will be going full time next summer. We're currently residents of VA and she will probably continue to work remotely for one of the colleges here so we'll owe VA state income tax on her pay. The general idea of most full timers is to get into a no income tax state. Other than her VA part time check . . .we've got my Navy retirement, her pension from the ACP headquartered in PA, and investment income. We would also like a state where no special drivers license is needed . . .we'll have a 5ver and either a F450 or an HDT tow vehicle.
The typical states you see recommended are FL, TX, or SD . . .I see on another thread that SD is pretty easy to handle, a user on that thread started in TX and moved. TX has special license requirements, SD and FL do not.
I realize that individual circumstances mean that everybody's case is different . . .but I hate to reinvent the wheel if it's already been done. We could just stay VA residents (they don't have any special license issues) . . .our son lives in Richmond so we'll have a mailing address . . .but we hate to pay a couple thousand bucks a year to VA when we don't live here. OTOH, it's a lot easier than changing at the beginning and we can always re-domicile in another state later. We won't be staying put in any location long enough to get legally classified as a resident . . .we're going to be nomads like Howard and Linda although will probably spend 2-3 months in the winter in someplace warm like FL, TX, or Palm Springs.
Has this problem already been solved?
neil
Neil,
Short answer would be, "No, it hasn't been fully answered." The reason is that in addition to states that don't charge income tax, some may charge high personal property tax, which would almost negate the option of choosing those states.
Also, some states will be tax-free on some form of pensions. But, they might have other issues that negate the option of choosing those states.
This topic has been discussed quite a bit. I'm sure that others will give you a lot better answer than I have because Jo and I are still working. Should they be slow in answering, use the search function of the forums. I'll also try to look around and provide you some links to more information.
Terry
We are FL residents and my RV tags cost $73.60 for this upcoming year. If you have owned the RV for more than 6 months and have had it registered in another State there are no additional charges. New RV purchases require that you pay the State sales tax. FL also has no personal income tax so if I ever get a pay check again this will be a large benefit as well.
While not the best health insurance rates, FL rates are much better than TX rates. I suspect that SD is better than both.
We chose SD. Let's see....No income tax, no property tax, no tax on military pensions. We did all our vehicle licensing through the mail with our mail service. You do have to GO to SD to get a driver's license, but only need to stay overnight and must do it, I think, within 90 days of registering your vehicles. I'm not sure about a special license for HDT, but you don't need one with an F450 pulling a 5th wheel.
We purchased a new 5th wheel and saved over $3000 by registering it in SD. Kansas has high personal property tax. They don't have a personal property tax per se, but do charge an "excise fee" the first time you register a new vehicle. It was still cheaper than the taxes we paid in KS. Don't pay it in the following years. In KS to register our Truck, car, motorcycles and old 5er it was well over 1200 a year. In SD renewal for Truck and 5er was less than $200 and I think even less than that. I'd have to go look.
Since you have Navy retirement I assume you have Tricare so health insurance shouldn't be an issue. Vehicle insurance was very reasonable.
I'll bet someone will chime in with TX info.
Doris
Also, check with an insurance agent on rates. Stay away from AARP (IMHO), get an agent that you think you can trust based on personal contact and they can suggest many ways to save money on insurance.
We have a homebase in a rural location near Lubbock, TX and our health insurance rates, vehicle insurance rates are pretty low. Moving from near San Antonio saved us a heap of money.
Yes, SD, TX, & FL are the most popular states for full-timers mainly because 1) they are no income tax states (and retirement income is not taxed), 2) there is no personal property tax on vehicle values, 3) there is no estate or inheritance tax, and 4) they have great mail forwarding services that make it easy to establish residency.
Yes, a special class of drivers license is needed for Texas (won't get into the requirements for that here).
Alaska, Wyoming, Washington, and Nevada are also "no income tax" states and have similar benefits to the top three - they just aren't as popular. For some, depending on individual situations, they may be better.
Tennessee and New Hampshire are also "no income tax" states in that they don't tax "earned income", but they do tax dividends and interest which can be an issue for those relying on that type of income.
Those that haven't purchased their rigs before establishing a full-timing residence may want to consider establishing residence in a "no sales tax" state first (Montana, Oregon, Delaware, New Hampshire, Alaska). They may be able to buy the RV and other vehicles without sales tax and then transfer to a "no income tax" state later (although they could still be hit with a "sales-type" tax if they try to transfer vehicles to another state too soon). ALSO, Montana, Oregon, and Delaware have income taxes and tax retirement income to some extent, so any sales tax savings may be offset by income tax depending on how the numbers work out. Montana also has a personal property tax on vehicles.
New Hampshire, as a "no income tax" and "no sales tax" state, taxes only "interest and dividends" so it may be a winner for those buying an RV and that don't have much income from those sources.
Alaska can be a great choice, but there are pros and cons, and the act of establishing residence there is simply not very convenient. With that said, if I were already a resident of Alaska, I certainly wouldn't change.
So, "the best state" depends on individual circumstances, and it's very, very important that each person do the homework for their own personal situation. Income levels, sources of income, convenience, taxes (income, sales, personal property), insurance costs and coverages, voting, license renewals, vehicle registration costs and renewals, and much more play a part in the decision. And "yes", it's not just particular states, but counties and zip codes within the states make a difference.
You will certainly want a state with no income tax, but I just want to caution others reading this thread that may not be the case in their situation.
-- Edited by Howard on Friday 30th of December 2011 10:40:10 PM
I've lived in Texas all my life and I'm full timing now with a mailing address in Texas. I have a question????? I don't have a motorhome, we have a 38ft. fiver, but I have never heard of needing a special drivers license for a motorhome. Can someone tell me about this special license you need????
Mel
2008 Carri-Lite Emerald
2011 F350 Ford Diesel
I lived in Nevada prior to full-timing,and our consulting business has been long based there,so we simply chose to remain Nevada residents,as there is no income tax. We use a UPS Store to recieve and fwd our mail.However DMV fees and vehicle insurance rates can be high,based on age of vehicles,and where you domicile in the state. For example,Nye county,just 50 miles west of Las Vegas (Clark County),has much much lower insurance rates,a lower sales tax rate, lower registration rates,and no smog requirement. Not surprisingly,the mailbox stores in Pahrump (Nye County) do a big business in box rentals,as Nevada Residency can be extablished this way.If one lived in CA,for example, it might be far more convenient to try to establish Nevada residency,due to distance factors.From what I read here,however,vehicle registration fees, and insurance are likely to be less in SD,& Fla.
Richard
Something in the back of my mind tells me it is about weight. 26,001 lbs or more GVW is the number I remember, for a Class A license. You can go to http://www.txdps.state.tx.us/DriverLicense/documents/DL-7.pdf and try to decipher the regulation. Remember, it is the gubmint talking and far be it from them to make anything simple.
Yep, Texas is the same as my state – You need a Class A or B (NON-CDL) for the RV if:
1. Class A driver license permits a person to drive any vehicle or combination
of vehicles with a gross combination weight rating of 26,001 pounds or
more, provided the gross vehicle weight rating of the vehicle(s) being towed
is in excess of 10,000 pounds; including
2. Class B driver license permits a person to drive the following vehicles,
except a motorcycle or moped:
a. a single unit vehicle with a gross vehicle weight rating of 26,001
pounds or more, and any such vehicle towing either a vehicle with a
gross vehicle weight rating that does not exceed 10,000 pounds, or a
farm trailer with a gross vehicle weight rating that does not exceed
20,000 pounds;
These are cut and paste from Chapter 1 of the Texas DL handbook.
These are the same for my state and if my 5er and truck have a CGWR of 26,001 lbs or more and the trailer is greater than 10,001 lbs I need a Class A (NON-CDL) license.
If the motor home has a GVWR of 26,001 lbs or more I need a Class B (or Class A) license.
Each state is different and your state of residency that issues the license determines what you need, not where you live or where you “are.”
Check it out. Your state laws may be very similar or perhaps more complicated. It depends. The lawyers can comment, but driving with the wrong "Class" of license is the same as driving without a license according to my legal advice.
Bill
Mel
Thanks all for your suggestions and comments . . .I think we'll likely go with either FL or SD with TX a distant third due to the licensing requirements. That was pretty much what I had figured out already . . .but wanted to make sure I hadn't failed to take something into account.
If your trailer has a GVW or more than 10000 pounds, you need a class A license.
Hi Michael:
What State are you referring to, Texas? ‘Just trying to clarify as it doesn’t say that in the Texas DL manual as cut and pasted above. It says a 10,000lb trailer and 26,001lbs combined weight. Perhaps you have other documentation as a Texas resident.
Nonetheless everyone should check their state of residency laws as that is the determining factor. In fact, I rechecked my state and since I got my Class A many years ago they changed the rules. At one time my state did require a Class A if the trailer was over 10,001 lbs regardless of the Combined Vehicle Weight. (Even said so on the licenses.) Now the rule reads just like Texas and other states. That is, the determining factor is a 10,001lb trailer and 26,001lb GCVW.
I suspect my state decided to get into compliance with the other states for reasons I won’t get into. But nonetheless the law changed in 2009 so most lighter weight 5ers don’t need a Class A here, only a Class C. It depends.
All that said to say, please check your individual state’s rules and don’t get caught if the DL clerk says “You don’t need a CDL to drive an RV.” True in most cases, but it depends on the state and size of the rig – two or three exceptions.. But as most know, a Class A is not a CDL. This is widely misunderstood by some and bears personal investigation and understanding
Actually I wish Howard would do a complete website section on this as it is just as important as insurance. Driving with the wrong class of license is the same as not having a license if you have an accident.
Please, don’t take this site as total authority, but it is a good place to start and has links to the state DMV sites where you can sometimes get the manual.
http://changingears.com/rv-sec-state-rv-license.shtml
Safe and legal travels
Bill
-- Edited by Bill and Linda on Friday 23rd of December 2011 05:02:38 PM
BUT we do have weighted tags here, meaning that your truck license plate has to be paid for the total weight of your vehicle plus the max weight that you might be towing.
It gets confusing here. I use my private truck to pull my business owned 18k boat trailer that has disc brakes. The 18k trailer plus my 8000 pound truck put me into CDL territory. But as long as I don't actually weigh that much I'm fine without the CDL.
If the boat trailers were privately owned then I would have to have a Class A non-CDL.
What aggravates me is that most insurance companies raise rates for class A licenses, and more for CDL.
1- There are a lot of colleges in Texas. Just about one on every street corner.
2- Texas is one of the most military friendly states in the entire US. There are 15 installations here with campgrounds at them or a MWR supported CG somewhere nearby. I estimate that there are 30-40 Veteran's health care facilities all over the state.
3- With a 5W, you will not need anything but a regular DL.
Texas is big enough to handle lots of snowbirds without being elbow to elbow. However, please be advised that there are two hangin' offenses for visitors. One is for Yankees to tell us how to do things and the other is wearing black socks with shorts.
True . . .lots of colleges there but she doens't really want to work per se . . .and what she's doing can all be done without going to the office so she doesn't look it as work. Besides; she likes it so who am I to argue.
Lots of military installations there . . .you got that right; but reading other posts in the thread and looking at changingears.com says that >26,000 GVWR or trailer > 10,000 requires the non commercial A or B license. The 450 is about 9,000 and the DRV or New Horizons we're looking at is 19,000 or 21,000 loaded so that gets both >26K and 10K tow.
Black socks with shorts . . .I take it that my short black biking socks are OK? Gotta wear something with the sneakers or else they get too gamey
I got white ones too . . .but figure if Lance Armstrong can get away with black then I can too.
If we were settling down permanently . . .Texas is where we'll go to; but I'm not convinced that for an RVer the hassle of needing the special license is worth it. I will have to see what the registration costs are here in VA . . .we'll be keeping a mailing address at our son's down in Richmond so staying VA residents at least for the remainder of 2012 is an option . . .otherwise we'll make a decision after considering sales tax, income tax, and insurance costs and change residency before we buy the RV.
Our mail service is "Your Best Address" (800-419-1690). Larry and Tina were very, very helpful. We did go spend two nights in Sioux Falls and really enjoyed our time there. It is a very nice city. Got our SD drivers license. You will need a motel or campground receipt with BOTH names on the receipt. If you use Larry's service please tell him that I told you about them.
You can see SD photos on our blog: http://puppypaths.blogspot.com.
Send me an email on this site if I can answer any questions for you about DRV as this is our second 5th wheel from them. Jack Mayer is a good contact for New Horizon.
Good luck,
Steve
I don't have any special information, just the inate ability to misread the rules. :) I do have first hand experience with the 26,000 limit though.
TXRVr, is now the time to remind "Yankees" of the difference between Yankees and Damyankees? You know, Yankees are still up north, damyankees are down here telling us what is wrong with us and saying WE are the ones with an accent :)
Yeah, well don't forget us Okies up here that are ready to "whoop-up" on the Yankees of every form, as well as the Texans. (Come to think of it, I think Oklahoma and Texas need to form their own country.)
Terry
Except I really would like to know what sources people have uncovered to get the information to make a decision about what state to set up in. Is there a tabulation anywhere? It's not that I don't trust everything I have read in this forum but I learned a lesson earlier in life related to important information: "Trust but verify".
We have just gone through a nightmare related to changing tow vehicles. We still have a residence in CA. but are nearly full timers. Our truck failed in TN and we traded it in at a dealer in Nashville. Getting the title from CA for the trade in and figuting out how to get a plate for the new TN truck when we live in CA was a rediculous exercise which we hope does not come back to bite us in the runp later (the truck now has a KY plate thanks to our daughters address in KY). Now we are on the road with a KY truck, a CA 5th, and CA DL.
We want to get all of our eggs in one basket before we goof something up.
Thanks in advance!
Go 49ers!
Ed, first of all, welcome to the forum.
That's part of the problem, I don't think that there is any one place where you can get all the information that you need to pick a state.
You need to go to DMV sites, contact insurance companies and do lots of research on things that will make a difference to you.
Our mail forwarding service, Alternative Resources http://www.alternativeresources.net/ out of Sioux Falls, SD was very helpful. They sent us information about taxes and a chart on what it would cost to register our vehicles in SD. Then, after contacting an insurance company, we were finally able to get an idea of what the cost would be.
It's not easy, but doing some research will pay off in the long run.
Oh, and yes, get all those eggs in one basket. It could get very complicated having vehicles registered in more than one state.
Jim
-- Edited by Jim01 on Tuesday 17th of January 2012 06:56:33 AM
We've decided to use SD . . .a quick search revealed America's Mailbox which is run by an RVer and Alternative Resources. I see that one reply recommended the latter . . .anybody have any experience with America's Mailbox? They're cheaper but sometimes you get what you pay for . . .and in any event it's the western edge of the state instead of eastern . . .so it's a farther drive from DC to get there.
I would guess the best way to proceed is go ahead and get residency/driver license before buying either the truck or the RV . . .assuming that's done can I register both directly in SD or is it a matter of registering in state of purchase (VA for the truck most likely and Kansas for the RV; we're almost surely going with a New Horizons unit) and then reregistering later? I'm pretty sure we can register the RV directly in SD but don't have any idea if one can do that with a new truck.
Will check them again since my sister is a TN resident. . .but I think we already eliminated them due to the sales tax. With a new New Horizons trailer, a new F450, and likely a used late model Jeep the sales tax on the 3 would be way up there. The trailer and truck are north of 200K between them. I suppose we could pay the 3% to VA instead and then reregister in TN after a year . . .I'll have to check again.
--later
Checked and they do have income tax on investment income . . .which means it's a no go for us; it's that investment income that's (partially anyway) allowing us to become fulltimers. Too bad . . .my sister would have liked it better.
-- Edited by laubenthal on Wednesday 18th of January 2012 01:45:29 PM
Neil,
Unless something has changed, and I don't think it has, in SD once you contact a Mail forwarding service and get an address, you can do everything else, (except getting a drivers license) by mail.
By mail, we established residency in June and registerd our vehicles without ever being in the state. We finally made it to SD in July to get our drivers licenses.
Since then, we have only been in SD twice. Both times to renew our drivers license.
Jim
Jim, thanks . . .I've contacted Alternative Resources and America's mailbox and both confirm that a single trip to get driver licenses and register to vote is all we need to . . .both the truck and trailer can be done via email. They charge a small fee for it . . .but it's a lot cheaper than going back.
We use Americas Mailbox and have been quite satisfied with them. We just go online to order mail, either a one time address or a repeating address.
We just did our renewal for our tags and was easy peasy. They sent us a reminder more than a month in advance with the amount we needed to pay. We sent them a money order and instructions where to send them. We received them within 10 days by priority mail.
You can choose from several different plans, change anytime and see everything online.
Thanks . . .they are cheaper so I am tempted to go with them but wanted to verify that service was fine before I do so. The only drawback is that when we drive from DC to get license/residency it's 300 miles closer to Alternative Resources in Sioux Falls than to Rapid City. But then we said to ourselves . . .we don't have to actually go to Rapid City if we use Americas Mailbox . . .as long as the mailbox is set up ahead of time we can just drive to the Sioux Falls and do license/vote/residency . . .then do all the rest via mail.
Yep! don't have to actually go where your mailbox is, just far enough into the state to get your license. Just be sure and check where you go though, because when we went to Sioux Falls the office there had odd hours and several other cities in the SW of the state are only open 1 day a month.
I saw that on the website for Alternative Resources in Sioux Falls . . .we'll verify that both the DMV and the voting registrar are open. I think that currently the DMV is closed Monday but not the registrar.
Well, I looked but probably missed reading it, but isn't it true that when registering in South Dakota that one needs to show a receipt for a hotel or motel or something as a requirement?
For some reason, such a stipulation has been mentioned before, but for the life of me I sure can't find it. Those of you registered in SD could sure help out some people in their planning for changing to SD.
Now, for a separate question as to registering one's trucks and fifth wheel in South Dakota, is there a time limit that would prevent one from having to pay the sales taxes for SD if they had already bought their equipment prior to moving? If so, does anyone know that that time limit would be?
Terry
The receipt for lodging is for voter registration; but you can still use your mailing address for everything else.
For the time period for registering . . .check on the Mailboxes America and/or Alternative Resources mailbox. One of them either on the web page or maybe in the forms you can download had the details about that I think. I took a quick look but didn't find it.
There is a 3% tax when you register but you get credit for tax paid already to another state. Both of the firms listed have pretty detailed info on their sites.
I think we're going to go with Americas Mailbox . . .they're cheaper. However, instead of driving all the way to the west side of SD we'll go to Sioux City instead . . .it's 600 miles less round trip for us from DC.
There are still many reasonable performing investments in the "market" that are relatively safe. But for sure, the market is not for everyone. And you do have to understand your tolerance for risk.