We are new to this forum and we will be RV’ers soon. We have settled on a truck for our needs and the big show is coming up. It will be our 2nd show of many to come so a time frame is not important. We have time on our side and we have some BIG decisions just as most.
The truck is a Chevy 2500HD. Have not made the purchase, still have our Tahoe, but for our needs, it must be a pickup, really don’t like the long box in a 1 ton and not yet sure if I gain anything here as no DRW's, 4x4 is a must and diesel drives me nuts. So let’s start there and this is where I get confused.
You go to these shows and weight is my biggest enemy, I believe. I for one WANT to be safe and NOT overloaded like some on the road. I could easily become a member of the weight police as I am that safe, or at least wannabe.
When just at the looking stage like this weekend, the high end big 5’ers weight too much and are out but great to look at. So the mid range and down rigs are our interest.And I am for now, until I get the door figures off a truck of choice and by no means is the truck above set in stone, what would be the maximum mid range GVWR of a 5’er we should be targeting in our RV show viewing (Ball park figure) and comfortable to tow?I’ve come up with nothing over 10,000# fully loaded that’s 7,000#+ 3000# of stuff. Is that close? Or is that even a fair question?
-- Edited by Bigrig at 14:17, 2009-02-01
NorCal Dan said
03:00 PM Feb 1, 2009
Welcome to the forum Bigrig. Are you planning to full-time in your RV?
Terry and Jo said
03:33 PM Feb 1, 2009
As someone who had done much in trucks of all sizes and who has been a salesman, I fall back on the "good" salesman aspect and ask probing questions. A good salesman will ask questions to determine what the CUSTOMER wants instead of trying to sell what the SALESMAN wants to sell, generally because of commissions.
First of all, will you be part-timing or full-timing? Keep in mind full timers either have practically everything they own in the fiver or they store stuff with family members or rent space. A part timer has a home within which to keep most possessions. This is a factor in how much the camper will hold.
Second, what is it about diesel that drives you nuts? If it is the noise, then go and listen to diesel trucks. For instance, the newer Fords are very quiet running. If it is the smell, there isn't much else to do but go with a gasoline rig.
Third, are you sure about a 7,000 pound fiver being able to hold 3,000 pounds of stuff? That seems like a high number for such a small trailer. I know of some larger units that don't carry much more than 3000 pounds, depending on what options were added to the camper.
Fourth, are you dead set against dual rear wheels? While single wheels may well help fuel mileage, dual wheels greatly increase stability when towing a fifth wheel. They also help with handling the "pin weight".
Fifth, and perhaps most important, how many people (and possibly pets) will be using this camper? Obviously, the larger the number, the bigger the camper needs to be. That effects the "stuff" part of things.
While you may not like the long box of a one ton, they can be helpful in carrying things that will be needed, but would overweigh the trailer if those things were put in it.
I think you may find that a gasoline engine equipped vehicle will be able to handle less weight than a diesel. 4 x 4 can be helpful, but it can cost you a little weight capability. For instance, the Ford F450 2wd with a diesel, equipped right, will pull 24,600 pounds. The same diesel 4x4, equipped the same, will pull 24,200 pounds. Granted, very little difference, but still a factor.
Keep in mind that GVWR applies to each individual unit (pickup or camper) and what that unit will weigh with everything included, i.e. water, fuel, groceries, etc. Neither unit needs to be overloaded. So, a truck needs to be capable to handle the weight of occupants, fuel and any payload in the back, including the weight applied by the "pin weight". THEN, the weight of the two units combined (GCVW) must not exceed the capability of the towing vehicle. Thus, both GVWR and GCVWR must be considered.
Fortunately, from what you have written, you have time to research this thoroughly. Leave no stone unturned. Even turn over stones in forums to get the answers you need. Many will tell you to pick the fifth wheel first to account for the size you need and THEN look at a towing vehicle.
If you exceed the size of vehicle you WANT to drive with the choice of fifth wheel that you WANT or NEED (due to space needed), then you may have to rethink everything.
Whatever you do, don't get discouraged. I've been researching, test driving, peering at weight specs in truck door frames and asking questions everywhere. I think I am getting there.
Also, you will get lots of GOOD advice from those that frequent Howard and Linda's site.
Enjoy.
Terry
thebearII said
09:23 AM Feb 2, 2009
BigRig,
A couple of things to ponder....
You mention diesels drive you nuts. I was the same way until I heard a 2007 Chevy/GMC Duramax diesel engine running. It was nearly as quiest as a gas engine. The new diesels are much quieter and less smelly than a few years ago. The advantage with diesels is the torque. 600 + lbs of torques vs 360 lbs for a gas engine. When you're pulling a 5th wheel, the torque matters.
Most of the 2500HD trucks will handle a 10,000 to 15,000 lb total weight (including cargo) 5th wheel. Many light trucks are rated, depending upon configuration, up to 17,000lbs.
Once you start looking at 5th wheels longer than 32 ft and with multiple slideouts, that's when you start seeing the heavier fivers. A 32 ft with 2 slideouts or shorter 5th wheel should match well with your 2500 HD.
Most RV'ers will advise, especially if you plan to use the fifth a lot, to go with as big of trailer and truck as you can afford. The bigger 5th wheel for comfort and liveability. If you're out in the 5'er and the weather is nasty for a few days, you'll be glad there's extra room to move around in.
The bigger truck for safety plus longevity. If you pull a trailer that is near the maximum weight for the truck, it puts a big strain on all of the components. A truck with more than enough towing capacity, will require less repairs over time. That's why a lot of the 5th wheel owners are moving towards medium duty (MDT) and heavy duty (HDT) trucks.
Good luck in your search. It's the right time to be shopping for a new RV and truck. I can't believe some of the low prices, I've been seeing out there.
Bigrig said
10:49 AM Feb 3, 2009
Thaks for the good response, let’s see if I can cover most of the questions that I created. We will be part timing for the next 5 years which may lead to full timing as our goal is all 30 ball parks. Another reason for the part time is it still and will hold a lot of family things we are not ready to give up right yet. The same goes for my passion/hobby of Elk Hunting. In reference to the diesel driving me nuts, we discussed this last night and concluded nothing is set in stone.I realize with a diesel set up, comes an increase in amenities shall we say.We are more prone to larger mid size, as size does matter. No, I am not sure about the 3,000# of stuff.It is an estimate, and it may be a high estimate but throw in that trip to the ocean with the grandkids, now you’ve got more stuff and fast approaching that 3,000# mark so it is all an estimate until we get closer to the final figure and then it will a more carefree tow. DRW, the truck has to be multifunctional for awhile. As to how many people, No pets, just us 2 big boned people who like to enjoy life.I have the time for the research and as my wife can attest, I will make good use of it.
I have been accused of turning over TOO many stones at times but this time I would like to make it as close to being right as possible. Picking a 5er first or the tow vehicle, I have read a lot on that very subject and have even kept score in this forum and the opinion of buying the 5’er first is in the lead by a slight margin of 4 in some 40 articles. That’s no fair bear II as you have a Kodiak, (insert jealousy here).For now our research will be toward an HD.And for the full timer which we are not, the MDT and HDT would be a serious choice.That would be cool.I like the HD’s but would give (^$*&(*& anything for a Kodiak. What’s the life expectancy of a maintained Duramax? Thaks for the figures as that is what I was looking for. These will be our starting figures for now and when the salesman says that BigHorn will tow this no problem, he may be right as he is trying to make a sale but I know, it would not work for us. I like the approach as comfort and livability is a must.If it is one thing in my favor, it’s the wife loves to shop.So off we go armed with a little more insight into this new lifestyle.Thaks to all.
thebearII said
12:58 PM Feb 3, 2009
Warranty on the Duramax is 5 years 100,000 miles with a deductible for each service event.
On the rest of the truck it's 2 years & unlimited miles.
MDTs are designed for 300,000 miles of service life
HDTs are 1 million miles service life, so even if you get one with 600,000 miles you still can expect more service than most people will use. HDTs are listed used for $20,000 to $50,000 in good to great shape and in most states with proper setup can be registered as an RV, so no CDL is required. The size is about the same as a crewcab dually or my Kodiak, just taller.
The MDTs and HDTs have a tight turning radius vs a light truck. I have been amazed at some of the u-turns I've been able to make since getting the Kodiak. Really helps when you're driving the truck around town. We use ours around town just like we did with our C3500 crew cab dually, it makes a great pickup.
It took me 10 years to finally bite the bullet and get the Kodiak. My next truck will be an HDT.
We are new to this forum and we will be RV’ers soon. We have settled on a truck for our needs and the big show is coming up. It will be our 2nd show of many to come so a time frame is not important. We have time on our side and we have some BIG decisions just as most.
The truck is a Chevy 2500HD. Have not made the purchase, still have our Tahoe, but for our needs, it must be a pickup, really don’t like the long box in a 1 ton and not yet sure if I gain anything here as no DRW's, 4x4 is a must and diesel drives me nuts. So let’s start there and this is where I get confused.
You go to these shows and weight is my biggest enemy, I believe. I for one WANT to be safe and NOT overloaded like some on the road. I could easily become a member of the weight police as I am that safe, or at least wannabe.
When just at the looking stage like this weekend, the high end big 5’ers weight too much and are out but great to look at. So the mid range and down rigs are our interest. And I am for now, until I get the door figures off a truck of choice and by no means is the truck above set in stone, what would be the maximum mid range GVWR of a 5’er we should be targeting in our RV show viewing (Ball park figure) and comfortable to tow? I’ve come up with nothing over 10,000# fully loaded that’s 7,000#+ 3000# of stuff. Is that close? Or is that even a fair question?
-- Edited by Bigrig at 14:17, 2009-02-01
As someone who had done much in trucks of all sizes and who has been a salesman, I fall back on the "good" salesman aspect and ask probing questions. A good salesman will ask questions to determine what the CUSTOMER wants instead of trying to sell what the SALESMAN wants to sell, generally because of commissions.
First of all, will you be part-timing or full-timing? Keep in mind full timers either have practically everything they own in the fiver or they store stuff with family members or rent space. A part timer has a home within which to keep most possessions. This is a factor in how much the camper will hold.
Second, what is it about diesel that drives you nuts? If it is the noise, then go and listen to diesel trucks. For instance, the newer Fords are very quiet running. If it is the smell, there isn't much else to do but go with a gasoline rig.
Third, are you sure about a 7,000 pound fiver being able to hold 3,000 pounds of stuff? That seems like a high number for such a small trailer. I know of some larger units that don't carry much more than 3000 pounds, depending on what options were added to the camper.
Fourth, are you dead set against dual rear wheels? While single wheels may well help fuel mileage, dual wheels greatly increase stability when towing a fifth wheel. They also help with handling the "pin weight".
Fifth, and perhaps most important, how many people (and possibly pets) will be using this camper? Obviously, the larger the number, the bigger the camper needs to be. That effects the "stuff" part of things.
While you may not like the long box of a one ton, they can be helpful in carrying things that will be needed, but would overweigh the trailer if those things were put in it.
I think you may find that a gasoline engine equipped vehicle will be able to handle less weight than a diesel. 4 x 4 can be helpful, but it can cost you a little weight capability. For instance, the Ford F450 2wd with a diesel, equipped right, will pull 24,600 pounds. The same diesel 4x4, equipped the same, will pull 24,200 pounds. Granted, very little difference, but still a factor.
Keep in mind that GVWR applies to each individual unit (pickup or camper) and what that unit will weigh with everything included, i.e. water, fuel, groceries, etc. Neither unit needs to be overloaded. So, a truck needs to be capable to handle the weight of occupants, fuel and any payload in the back, including the weight applied by the "pin weight". THEN, the weight of the two units combined (GCVW) must not exceed the capability of the towing vehicle. Thus, both GVWR and GCVWR must be considered.
Fortunately, from what you have written, you have time to research this thoroughly. Leave no stone unturned. Even turn over stones in forums to get the answers you need. Many will tell you to pick the fifth wheel first to account for the size you need and THEN look at a towing vehicle.
If you exceed the size of vehicle you WANT to drive with the choice of fifth wheel that you WANT or NEED (due to space needed), then you may have to rethink everything.
Whatever you do, don't get discouraged. I've been researching, test driving, peering at weight specs in truck door frames and asking questions everywhere. I think I am getting there.
Also, you will get lots of GOOD advice from those that frequent Howard and Linda's site.
Enjoy.
Terry
We will be part timing for the next 5 years which may lead to full timing as our goal is all 30 ball parks. Another reason for the part time is it still and will hold a lot of family things we are not ready to give up right yet. The same goes for my passion/hobby of Elk Hunting.
In reference to the diesel driving me nuts, we discussed this last night and concluded nothing is set in stone. I realize with a diesel set up, comes an increase in amenities shall we say. We are more prone to larger mid size, as size does matter.
No, I am not sure about the 3,000# of stuff. It is an estimate, and it may be a high estimate but throw in that trip to the ocean with the grandkids, now you’ve got more stuff and fast approaching that 3,000# mark so it is all an estimate until we get closer to the final figure and then it will a more carefree tow.
DRW, the truck has to be multifunctional for awhile.
As to how many people, No pets, just us 2 big boned people who like to enjoy life.I have the time for the research and as my wife can attest, I will make good use of it.
I have been accused of turning over TOO many stones at times but this time I would like to make it as close to being right as possible.
Picking a 5er first or the tow vehicle, I have read a lot on that very subject and have even kept score in this forum and the opinion of buying the 5’er first is in the lead by a slight margin of 4 in some 40 articles.
That’s no fair bear II as you have a Kodiak, (insert jealousy here). For now our research will be toward an HD. And for the full timer which we are not, the MDT and HDT would be a serious choice. That would be cool. I like the HD’s but would give (^$*&(*& anything for a Kodiak.
What’s the life expectancy of a maintained Duramax?
Thaks for the figures as that is what I was looking for. These will be our starting figures for now and when the salesman says that BigHorn will tow this no problem, he may be right as he is trying to make a sale but I know, it would not work for us.
I like the approach as comfort and livability is a must. If it is one thing in my favor, it’s the wife loves to shop. So off we go armed with a little more insight into this new lifestyle. Thaks to all.