We have been considering the Mobile Suites 38-footers, originally the 38 RLSB3 and now the 38 TKSB3.Because of that, we have been very concerned with getting a tow vehicle capable of pulling the weight.So, below is what I have discovered with looking at brochures, talking to salesman (not a really trustworthy source), and checking weight ratings on the plates in the doors of trucks.This has been about a 9 month effort of looking and test driving. Originally, I began with the Ford F450 but while I was concerned with the mileage, I was especially concerned with controlling the trailer on downhill slopes of mountain passes. I looked at GMC and Dodge equivalents (4500 series), Ford F550 and F650, HDT and MDT. Everything considered, we require that the wife be comfortable with driving the rig. The Ford F550 falls short in towing capability and the F650 is too expensive for what it offers. I have chosen to not go with HDT because of the substandard field of view through the windows and mirrors.While it would be best to handle weight and the engine would last the longest (theoretically about 1,000,000 miles), I don’t like the size and I have no plans on putting on that many miles.Also, my wife wouldn’t be comfortable with driving the HDT.
I have ruled out the MDT because it is difficult to find one that is reasonably priced, can pull the weight, and has good visibility.The GMC and Dodges that we looked at were limited to a GCVWR of 26,000 pounds, as compared to the Ford F450 at 33,000.Based on a brochure and salesman comment, one would have to go to a Dodge 7500 to be able to have a GCVWR of 33,000 pounds.Since GMC’s brochures are so limited in information, I have no idea how big of a chassis cab one would have to get to have the right capacity. We considered the Freightliner mini, the SportChassis, but at nearly $100,000 for a used one, that pretty well eliminates that vehicle.Their engine mileage life is estimated to be around 500,000 miles, but I can’t see the price/mileage ratio being all that good. Now, back to the Ford F450.Specifically a dually, crew cab, with automatic transmission with the Tow/Haul feature, and two wheel drive.GCVWR is 33,000 lbs with trailer towing weight of 24,600 in that configuration.2008 models required a 4:88 rear end to tow a weight of 24,500, but the 2009 model has a 4:30 rear end capable of pulling 24,600 pounds.Also, the maximum payload for the F450 is 6,190 pounds, allowing good pin weight capacity.
If the transmission is equipped with the Tow/Haul feature, it provides the capability of controlling a load on a downhill slope.That is apparently why I could never find an aftermarket exhaust brake for the F450, even though others are out there for the Dodge and GMC’s. Below are links to YouTube videos about the Ford F450 in a 150,000 mile test drive:
The Mobile Suites that you are considering can be towed just fine with the F450/F550. I tow my Elite Suites with my 2001 F550 and it pulls it just fine although I'm near the max limits. With the Mobile Suites and a F450 you should be less than 28K for a GCWR. As you said your max is 33K and you should be fine.
If I had it to do over I would have went with the MDT. I did install a Banks exhaust brake on the F550 for downhill grades just for the peace of mind.
Be very sure what you think you want to do, it will be with you a long time. If you decide you made a wrong decision it will cost you.
Hope this helps.
Bob
thebearII said
05:20 PM Jan 28, 2009
Terry & Jo,
If you park an HDT single rear axle truck next to a MDT or F450 Crew Cab you will find the basic foot print of the vehicles are the same (wheelbase & width). Only real difference is the height.
Equipped with cameras and monitors the view to the side and rear can be setup better than looking through the windows of a light truck.
Cost is much less for an HDT. Longevity is a plus and the extra height allows you to see further ahead for safety. Plus the stopping power can't be beat.
If you can talk to Jack Mayer, he posts on this site and escapees. He knows HDT's inside and out.
I have a Chevy 4500 Kodiak and am so glad I went with it instead of a 3500. My next truck will be an HDT.
Jack Mayer said
05:31 PM Jan 28, 2009
It is interesting that you find the mirrors on an HDT substandard. They are by far the best of all the vehicles you specify. While an HDT is not for everyone, a properly modified HDT is as easy to drive as an F450/550, takes up little additional footprint on the road (about 18"-24" longer, and maneuvers FAR FAR better. Consider that all other trucks require the kingpin to be over or near the axle, while the HDT permits the location to be as far as 6' BEHIND the axle centerline. This allows truer tracking of the trailer in corners, and better backin maneuvering.
HDTs have fully automated transmissions - they are fairly common now. And it is simple to add windows to the sleeper should one choose to do so. In addition, the ability to haul unlimited weight (for all practical purposes) on the deck meand large drom boxes (storage boxes) , Smart cars, motorcycles, and ATVs are all available for loading without consideration for weight. In addition, the sleeper is big enough to overnight in for several nights, so you can take it on side trips.
Most people are initially put off by the tallness of the HDT, but that is quickly overcome. The footprint on the road is the same as an MDT and near a 450. It has some distinct advantages, especially when combined with one or two motorcycles, or a Smart car. The HDT is not for everyone, but needs to be carefully considered if towing heavy stuff, or needing lots of storage space.
In the situation described by the OP a 450 will do the job.
Terry and Jo said
09:18 PM Jan 28, 2009
I apologize for not explaining in the first post, but I thought it was getting too long as it was.
I am quite familiar with HDT's and MDT's. I have close to 15 years combined experience with those sizes of vehicles, driving them professionally. I have driven both cabover and conventional semi-trailer rigs as well as bobtails as big or bigger than most MDT's.
That experience does not include the experience I have with farm trucks and pickups pulling various types of trailers.
My experiences lead me to believe that the Ford F450 is more suited to the needs that my wife and I feel we need. In all of our research, we have found that she would be comfortable with driving a 42 foot motorhome, but she doesn't feel comfortable with HDT's. When I was driving semi-trailer rigs, we went out onto an old abandoned airport and she drove around on the runway and taxiways. She was not comfortable with it and that was only driving forward.
Also, once we make our purchases, we will be living in the RV for several years yet until we pay everything off and qualify for our retirement. In that period of time, an HDT does not qualify as a good "second vehicle" when one is needed.
Thanks for any comments from anyone, because as far as I am concerned, I don't think I can ever learn enough.
Terry
Jack Mayer said
09:53 AM Jan 29, 2009
Terry, I think you did your research well, and it sounds like you picked an appropriate vehicle for the two of you. My points were more addressed to the general audience reading this. IMO, if considering a 450/550/MDT class vehicle one should also consider the HDT, for some of the reasons I pointed out. I'll be the first to admit that an HDT is not for everyone. But people need to consider their lifestyle carefully when selecting a hauler - not just for today, but what they may want to do in the future. With rare exception, if an MDT will do the job for you, an HDT will do it better. Very few people REQUIRE the things that are exclusive to the MDT - namely 4 doors. Really, that is about the only difference, since you can put glass around an HDT. But the BIGGEST thing that keeps people considering an MDT away from an HDT is the perceived size/intimidation factor. Some people just can not wrap their heads around the tallness. And that is a perfectly valid reason to choose another vehicle....but IMO one needs to consider ALL the options. Especially if a person has no experience.
thebearII said
10:07 AM Jan 29, 2009
Terry,
Sorry I made the assumption you had no experience with HDTs.
HDT's are relatively new tow vehicles for use in the RV world so a lot of people, like Jack says, aren't familiar with the actual size and capabilities.
That's the great thing about forums like this, you can get as much information as (or even more than) you need when researching something.
Originally, I began with the Ford F450 but while I was concerned with the mileage, I was especially concerned with controlling the trailer on downhill slopes of mountain passes. I looked at GMC and Dodge equivalents (4500 series), Ford F550 and F650, HDT and MDT.
Everything considered, we require that the wife be comfortable with driving the rig.
The Ford F550 falls short in towing capability and the F650 is too expensive for what it offers.
I have chosen to not go with HDT because of the substandard field of view through the windows and mirrors. While it would be best to handle weight and the engine would last the longest (theoretically about 1,000,000 miles), I don’t like the size and I have no plans on putting on that many miles. Also, my wife wouldn’t be comfortable with driving the HDT.
I have ruled out the MDT because it is difficult to find one that is reasonably priced, can pull the weight, and has good visibility. The GMC and Dodges that we looked at were limited to a GCVWR of 26,000 pounds, as compared to the Ford F450 at 33,000. Based on a brochure and salesman comment, one would have to go to a Dodge 7500 to be able to have a GCVWR of 33,000 pounds. Since GMC’s brochures are so limited in information, I have no idea how big of a chassis cab one would have to get to have the right capacity.
We considered the Freightliner mini, the SportChassis, but at nearly $100,000 for a used one, that pretty well eliminates that vehicle. Their engine mileage life is estimated to be around 500,000 miles, but I can’t see the price/mileage ratio being all that good.
Now, back to the Ford F450. Specifically a dually, crew cab, with automatic transmission with the Tow/Haul feature, and two wheel drive. GCVWR is 33,000 lbs with trailer towing weight of 24,600 in that configuration. 2008 models required a 4:88 rear end to tow a weight of 24,500, but the 2009 model has a 4:30 rear end capable of pulling 24,600 pounds. Also, the maximum payload for the F450 is 6,190 pounds, allowing good pin weight capacity.
If the transmission is equipped with the Tow/Haul feature, it provides the capability of controlling a load on a downhill slope. That is apparently why I could never find an aftermarket exhaust brake for the F450, even though others are out there for the Dodge and GMC’s.
Below are links to YouTube videos about the Ford F450 in a 150,000 mile test drive:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yBR_yfLHAjI
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Vk1ysgy_kL0
Terry
I am quite familiar with HDT's and MDT's. I have close to 15 years combined experience with those sizes of vehicles, driving them professionally. I have driven both cabover and conventional semi-trailer rigs as well as bobtails as big or bigger than most MDT's.
That experience does not include the experience I have with farm trucks and pickups pulling various types of trailers.
My experiences lead me to believe that the Ford F450 is more suited to the needs that my wife and I feel we need. In all of our research, we have found that she would be comfortable with driving a 42 foot motorhome, but she doesn't feel comfortable with HDT's. When I was driving semi-trailer rigs, we went out onto an old abandoned airport and she drove around on the runway and taxiways. She was not comfortable with it and that was only driving forward.
Also, once we make our purchases, we will be living in the RV for several years yet until we pay everything off and qualify for our retirement. In that period of time, an HDT does not qualify as a good "second vehicle" when one is needed.
Thanks for any comments from anyone, because as far as I am concerned, I don't think I can ever learn enough.
Terry